[1. Wildland Fire Prevention and Mitigation Presentation. A brief update by St. Johns County Fire Rescue on the wildland fire danger for St. Johns County and an overview of the department’s wildland fire operations plan and resources. Discussion will center on our response, partner agreements with the Florida Forest Service, the State Emergency Response Plan, community engagement and the geographic and weatherrelated circumstances that historically impact fire danger and behavior in our region.]

AND SO I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA TO HAVE THE CHIEF COME IN AND GIVE US A LITTLE PRESENTATION ON WHAT WE DO TO PREVENT THINGS LIKE THAT.

YOU'RE ON. GOOD MORNING, MADAM CHAIR. COMMISSIONER SHAWN MCGEE, FIRE CHIEF, SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY FIRE RESCUE.

SO, AS YOU STATED, COMMISSIONER JOSEPH, THIS MORNING, I'M HERE TO GIVE A BRIEF UPDATE ON THE DEPARTMENT'S FIRE OPERATIONS AND WILDLAND FIREFIGHTING. ALSO WITH ME IS ANTHONY PETTIT WITH THE FLORIDA DIVISION OF FORESTRY.

[01:15:01]

FOREST SERVICE, THEY'RE THE ULTIMATE AUTHORITY HAVING JURISDICTION OVER WILDFIRES IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA.

WE ARE WE ACT MORE AS A SUPPORT AGENCY TO THEM IN THEIR EFFORTS.

WE HAVE A STRONG WORKING RELATIONSHIP AND PARTNERSHIP WITH THEM.

SO I WILL START WITH OUR DEPARTMENT HIGHLIGHTING WHAT WE DO AND HOW WE HANDLE THESE TYPES OF SITUATIONS.

I'LL PASS IT OFF TO ANTHONY TO LET HIM TALK ABOUT HIS FORESTRY SIDE, AND I'LL WRAP IT UP WITH ANY QUESTIONS AFTER THAT.

SO I WON'T SPEND TOO MUCH TIME ON WHAT'S HAPPENING OUT IN OUT IN CALIFORNIA, THESE TYPES OF FIRES.

WE'LL GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE. THEY'RE REALLY DEPENDENT ON WEATHER, ENVIRONMENT, TOPOGRAPHY ARE REALLY THE MAIN THREE THINGS THAT DRIVE THESE AND IMPACT THE FIRE BEHAVIOR AND SPREADING THESE TYPES OF EVENTS. WHAT CALIFORNIA IS EXPERIENCING REALLY IS A BUNCH OF INDIVIDUAL THINGS THAT CAME TOGETHER AT THE WRONG TIME, THAT LED TO THE DEVASTATION THAT'S GOING ON OUT THERE. AND MY HEARTS AND PRAYERS GO OUT TO THOSE FOLKS OUT THERE.

IT'S A LEVEL OF DEVASTATION I HAVEN'T WITNESSED IN MY 26 YEARS IN THIS BUSINESS.

AND AGAIN, MY HEART GOES OUT TO MY FELLOW FIREFIGHTERS OUT THERE THAT ARE RUNNING IN THERE TO TRY AND STOP THIS AS BEST THEY CAN.

IT'S A NEAR IMPOSSIBLE SITUATION WITH WHAT'S GOING ON OUT THERE.

AND THEY'RE THEY'RE GIVING IT EVERYTHING THEY HAVE. SO SO SOME REAL QUICK DIFFERENT THINGS WITH ENVIRONMENT, TOPOGRAPHY, YOU KNOW, CALIFORNIA VERSUS FLORIDA WHEN YOU GO OUT TO CALIFORNIA, OBVIOUSLY, THIS IS THEIR BRUSHFIRE SEASON. THIS IS THEIR DRY SEASON. THEY HAVE THE SANTA ANA WINDS THAT KICKED IN AT 100 MILES AN HOUR, WHICH IS UNPRECEDENTED FOR THEM IN THESE TYPES THESE TYPES OF EVENTS. TOPOGRAPHY.

AS FAR AS FLAT LAND VERSUS. MOUNTAINOUS TERRAIN.

FIRE IS GOING TO RUN UPHILL A LOT FASTER THAN IT WILL ACROSS THE FLAT SURFACE. SO WHEN YOU COMBINE THE DRYNESS, THE TOPOGRAPHY AND THOSE WINDS, IT'S A NEAR IMPOSSIBLE SITUATION FOR THEM TO DEAL WITH OUT THERE, SPECIFICALLY WITH THE WINDS. I MEAN, YOU BASICALLY HAVE A BLOWTORCH THAT'S RUNNING THROUGH THESE COMMUNITIES, AND IT'S REALLY HARD TO GET AHEAD OF THEM WHEN THOSE LIGHT OFF LIKE THAT, ESPECIALLY THOSE HARD TO ACCESS AREAS WITH THE MOUNTAINOUS TERRAIN IN THE FORESTS, THEY RELY ON AIRDROPS HEAVILY TO MITIGATE A LOT OF THAT FIRE SPREAD.

UNFORTUNATELY, WITH THE WINDS AND EVERYTHING, HOW THAT WAS GOING ON WITH THE WINDS WERE NOT ABLE TO GET THOSE AIR ASSETS UP, YOU KNOW, IN A TIMELY MANNER TO TRY AND STOP THAT SPREAD. SO THAT'S A COUPLE OF THE QUICK DIFFERENCES BETWEEN WHAT'S GOING OUT THERE WITH WHAT'S HERE.

YOU KNOW, FLORIDA IS PRETTY FLAT. SO WE DON'T HAVE THE MOUNTAINOUS TERRAIN. WE STAY PRETTY DRY OR STAY PRETTY WET WITH HUMIDITY AND WEATHER AND WINDS.

YOU KNOW, WE DON'T GET THOSE TYPES OF WINDS UNTIL WE GET INTO HURRICANE SEASON. SO FORTUNATELY FOR US, WE HAVE OUR OWN UNIQUE CHALLENGES HERE IN HERE IN THE STATE, BUT NOTHING TO LIKE WHAT THEY'RE DEALING WITH OUT THERE. SO WHEN YOU GET TO THE LEVEL WHAT'S HAPPENED TO CALIFORNIA, THERE'S MULTIPLE AGENCY RESPONSES IN THESE TYPES OF EVENTS. HERE FOR THE COUNTY, WE HAVE A PARTNERSHIP WITH THE FLORIDA FOREST SERVICE, WHICH AGAIN, AS I STATED EARLIER, IS THE AUTHORITY HAVING JURISDICTION OVER THESE EVENTS. SO THE MAIN RESPONSIBLE AGENCY FOR THOSE, WE ARE SUPPORT AGENCY FOR THEM. WE HAVE A STRONG WORKING RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM OVER THE YEARS, GOING ALL THE WAY BACK TO 98 WHEN, YOU KNOW, WE EXPERIENCED OUR WORST FIRES IN THE COUNTY'S HISTORY BACK THEN.

OBVIOUSLY OUR COUNTY FIRE RESCUE, SAINT AUGUSTINE FIRE DEPARTMENT, WE HAVE AN AGREEMENT WITH THEM AND THEIR RESOURCES.

THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE PLAYS A VITAL ROLE WHEN THESE GET TO THESE LEVEL.

THEY ARE THE AGENCY RESPONSIBLE FOR ALL EVACUATIONS.

IF ANY EVACUATIONS ARE GOING TO BE CALLED FOR. THEY WILL ASSIST IN EVACUATIONS.

WE ALSO HAVE MUTUAL AID AGREEMENTS WITH THE SURROUNDING COUNTIES FOR ASSETS AND PERSONNEL.

IF WE NEED THEM. AND WE ALWAYS HAVE THE STATE EMERGENCY RESPONSE PLAN, WHICH ALLOWS US TO CALL IN FOR ASSETS OR RESOURCES FROM ALL ACROSS THE ACROSS THE STATE.

AND THEN IN TURN, WE CAN ALSO PROVIDE THOSE ASSETS TO SURROUNDING COUNTIES IF THEY NEED IT.

SO THE STRATEGY IN DEALING WITH THESE FROM A FIRE DEPARTMENT STANDPOINT, WILDLAND FIREFIGHTING AND STRUCTURAL FIREFIGHTING ARE TWO DIFFERENT TYPES OF FIREFIGHTING COMPLETELY. SO FOR US, OUR MAIN RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE DEPARTMENT IS STRUCTURAL PROTECTION, PROPERTY PRESERVATION AND LIFE SAFETY. THAT'S OUR FIRST GOAL WHEN WE GET ON SCENE OF THESE EVENTS, IF IT'S A SMALL FIRE, YOU KNOW, SMALL AREA, NOT MUCH ACREAGE, WE CAN GET TO IT, WE CAN ACCESS IT AND WE CAN PUT IT OUT.

YOU KNOW, WE WILL DO THAT AND LEAVE THE FORESTRY UNITS AVAILABLE AS BEST WE CAN.

THERE A DISTRICT SET UP SO THEY THEY COVER A WHOLE LOT OF AREA.

SO IF WE CAN GET THERE AND TAKE CARE OF IT OURSELVES AND LEAVE THEM FREED UP FOR ANY OTHER EVENTS.

SO WHEN WE GO TO THESE TYPES OF EVENTS, STRUCTURE PROTECTION, PROPERTY CONSERVATION CREWS WILL DEPLOY DEPENDING ON THE SITUATION.

I KNOW THERE'S SOME CONCERN WITH THE CLOSENESS OF SOME HOUSES AND NEIGHBORHOODS AND HOW THEY BUILD UP TO NATURAL AREAS. CREWS ARE TRAINED TO TRAINED TO GO AND GO IN BETWEEN THE HOUSES THAT ARE MOST THREATENED. THEY WILL MAKE A DEFENSIBLE SPACE AS BEST THEY CAN, CLEAR OUT DEAD VEGETATION, WHERE THEY CAN MAKE SURE THE HOUSE AND GUTTERS ARE CLEAR OF ANY DEAD DEBRIS VEGETATION, AND THEN THEY WILL PUT HOSE LINES IN THEMSELVES IN PLACE TO PROTECT THOSE STRUCTURES.

A LOT OF TIMES IT'LL LOOK LIKE CREWS ARE DOING NOTHING AS A FIRE IS BURNING.

BUT THE GOAL, IF YOU HAVE A DEFENSIBLE SPACE AND THE FIRE IS APPROACHING, THAT YOU WANT THAT TO BURN UP TO THAT DEFENSIBLE SPACE SO IT CAN'T RELATE AGAIN IN THE FUTURE. SO THERE IS SOME CONFUSION. SOMETIMES IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE WE'RE PUTTING THE FIRE OUT OR, YOU KNOW, WE'RE LETTING IT BURN. IN SOME CASES, YOU WANT TO LET IT BURN AND FORCE YOU TO EXPLAIN HOW THEY DEAL WITH THESE SITUATIONS.

THEY'LL COME IN WITH THEIR BULLDOZERS, LARGE ACREAGE FIRES, PLOW A WHOLE LINE AROUND THE FIRE,

[01:20:04]

AND YOU WANT THE FIRE TO BURN TO THAT LINE TO KEEP IT FROM REIGNITING.

SO WE ALSO TRAIN CONSISTENTLY FOR THESE TYPES OF EVENTS.

AGAIN, LIKE I SAID, WITH STRUCTURE PROTECTION AND MAKING DEFENSIBLE SPACES, WE TRAIN HEAVILY ON WATER SUPPLY IN AREAS WHERE WE MAY NOT HAVE ACCESS TO HYDRANTS.

WE DO HAVE CONTINGENCY PLANS IN PLACE TO PROVIDE WATER FOR THESE TYPES OF FIRES.

WE ALSO DO CLASSES WITH FORESTRY. I KNOW THEY PUT A FEW OF OUR PEOPLE THROUGH CHAINSAW CLASSES AND YOU KNOW, MITIGATING THINGS ON THEIR END AND MOP UP OPERATIONS.

TO ASSIST THEM. SO FOR PREPARATION AND PREVENTION, AGAIN, AS FAR AS THE COUNTY IS CONCERNED, WE DO HAVE SPECIALTY APPARATUS THAT ARE IN PLACE SPREAD OUT THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY. CALL THEM BRUSH TRUCKS. CURRENTLY WE HAVE FOUR BRUSH TRUCKS.

WE HAVE ONE LITTLE SIDE BY SIDE. WE CALL IT A MERV FOR QUICK ACCESS TO SOME OF THESE PLACES IF WE CAN GET CREWS BACK THERE.

WE HAVE THREE ADDITIONAL BRUSH TRUCKS THAT ARE ON ORDER THAT SHOULD BE DELIVERED WITHIN THE NEXT 18 MONTHS OR SO.

CHIEF WILSON AND HIS LOGISTICS STAFF WERE ABLE TO BE EFFICIENT IN THE PURCHASE OF THESE THREE TRUCKS, BECAUSE WE'RE ACTUALLY GOING TO BE ABLE TO USE THEM FOR HIGH WATER TRUCKS IN CONJUNCTION WITH BRUSH FIRE TRUCKS. TRUCK. SO YOU KNOW, THE WAY THE SEASON FLOWS, WE GO FROM LIKE BRUSHFIRE SEASON TO HURRICANE SEASON.

WE CAN USE THEM FOR BRUSH TRUCKS. HURRICANE SEASON ROLLS AWAY. WE CONVERT THEM INTO HIGH WATER TRUCKS TO HELP US GET US THROUGH THE HURRICANE SEASON. WE ALSO HAVE TWO TRUCKS ON LOAN FROM THE FOREST SERVICE THAT THEY LET US USE TO AID US IN OUR ABILITIES TO GET TO THESE TYPES OF FIRES.

WE ALSO SEND OUT DAILY FIRE WEATHER FORECASTS TO THE CREWS THAT ARE ON DUTY EVERY DAY.

LIKE I SAID, THESE ARE VERY WEATHER DEPENDENT. AS FAR AS THE THREAT, THE SPREAD AND WHAT THE FIRE IS GOING TO DO.

SO EVERY MORNING THE FIRE WEATHER FORECAST GOES OUT TO ALL CREWS THROUGHOUT THE DEPARTMENT IN PREPARATION FOR ANY TYPE OF THREATS THAT MAY OCCUR FOR THAT DAY.

ONCE WE GET INTO INTO BRUSHFIRE SEASON, WHICH FOR US IS LATE SPRING, EARLY SUMMER IT'S KIND OF OUR, OUR TIMELINE WHEN IT'S A LITTLE BIT DRY BEFORE WE GET INTO THE SUMMER RAINS. DURING THAT TIME, WE DO DO PUBLIC MESSAGING, AS FAR AS YOU KNOW, PREPARING YOUR HOMES FOR THESE TYPES OF THINGS, CLEARING OUT DEAD, DEAD VEGETATION, CLEARING OFF YOUR ROOFS, CLEARING OUT YOUR GUTTERS.

SO AS THAT SEASON ROLLS AROUND IN LATE SPRING, WE START TO PUSH OUT THAT MESSAGING TO KIND OF DEFEND YOUR HOMES.

SO THAT'S A QUICK, HIGH LEVEL OVERVIEW OF HOW WE'RE GOING TO HANDLE THESE SITUATIONS.

AGAIN, I KNOW THERE'S SOME CONCERN, ESPECIALLY CALIFORNIA WITH FIRE HYDRANTS AND WATER SUPPLY ISSUES.

HERE IN THE COUNTY, ALL OF OUR HYDRANTS ARE PROVIDED WATER BY THE UTILITY DEPARTMENT.

THEY ALL HAVE WATER TO THEM. THEY'RE MAINTAINED BY THE UTILITY DEPARTMENT.

AND WE ALSO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT IS RESPONSIBLE FOR TESTING OF THESE HYDRANTS.

SO ABOUT TWICE A YEAR MINIMUM, THESE HYDRANTS ARE GETTING TOUCHED IN THE COUNTY.

AND IF THERE'S ANY ISSUES WITH THOSE THEY'RE IMMEDIATELY ADDRESSED BY THE COUNTY UTILITY DEPARTMENT. WE HAVE A GREAT WORKING RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM. THEY'RE QUICK ON THE JOB.

ANYTIME AN ISSUE IS IDENTIFIED AND THEY CAN, THEY CAN GET ON IT AND REPAIR ANY SITUATIONS THERE.

AND ADDITIONALLY, WE, LIKE I STATED BEFORE, WITH THE WATER TRAINING OPERATIONS, WE DO HAVE THE ABILITY TO PULL FROM STATIC SOURCES.

RETENTION PONDS, LAKES, STATIC BODIES OF WATER.

WE TRAIN ON THAT QUITE A BIT. AND IN ADDITION TO OUR TANKER SHUTTLE OPERATIONS WITH OUR WATER TANKERS AT OUR STAFF, WE CAN BASICALLY MAKE PORTABLE HYDRANTS TO GET THEM TO THE SCENE.

SO WITH THAT I'D LIKE TO INTRODUCE ANTHONY PETTIT.

HE'S THE FLORIDA FORESTRY SERVICE DISTRICT MANAGER.

HE'S RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS AREA. I WILL PASS IT OFF TO HIM AND THEN COME BACK FOR ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS AFTER THAT.

ALL RIGHT. GOOD MORNING. A LOT OF STUFF THAT THE CHIEF JUST WENT OVER.

YOU'RE GOING TO HEAR AGAIN. ALL RIGHT, SO BUNNELL DISTRICT WHERE SAINT JOHN'S, FLAGLER AND VOLUSIA COUNTY.

WE HAVE FIVE STATE FORESTS. THREE OF THEM ARE IN SAINT JOHNS.

WE HAVE 55 PERSONNEL. 30 OF THEM ARE FIREFIGHTERS.

WE HAVE EIGHT OF THEM IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY. I HAVE THREE SUPERVISORS UNDERNEATH ME, AND I AND I HAVE ONE OF THEM HERE IN SAINT JOHN'S.

OUR EQUIPMENT. WE HAVE 15 MEDIUM TRACTORS. WE HAVE ONE HEAVY.

AND THE HEAVY IS LOCATED DOWN IN IN VOLUSIA. WE HAVE SIX BRUSH UNITS AND ONE FIXED WING PLANE.

SO WE HAVE FOUR MEDIUM TRACTOR PLOW UNITS HERE IN SAINT JOHN'S.

WE HAVE TWO BRUSH UNITS HERE. TRAINING. WE GO THROUGH ANNUAL TRAINING.

WE HAVE SPECIALIZED TRAINING. SO JUST RECENTLY LAST WEEK, SOUTHERN AREA ENGINE ACADEMY, WE PUT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT UP FOR SERVICE. JUST A LOT OF DIFFERENT COOPERATORS GO THROUGH THIS.

AND THEY ALL WORK TOGETHER WITH KNOWING HOW TO COMBAT WILDFIRES WITH BRUSH UNITS, HOW TO DO THE THE WATER SHUTTLING,

[01:25:05]

THAT TYPE OF STUFF. WE HAVE ON THE JOB TRAINING.

ON THE JOB TRAINING, A LOT OF TIMES WE DO THAT ON PRESCRIBED BURNS.

SO THE PRESCRIBED BURNS WILL HAVE THE FIRE DEPARTMENT COME OUT, THE EP COME OUT.

SO WE ALL HAVE THE SAME COMMON COMMUNICATION DEPLOYMENTS IN 2024.

WE HAD 65 DEPLOYMENTS FROM MY DISTRICT. WE HAVE 55 PEOPLE.

SO WE HAD PEOPLE GOING OUT NUMEROUS TIMES. THESE ARE FIRES IN FLORIDA.

THESE ARE FIRES OUT WEST, OREGON, CALIFORNIA AND SO ON.

AND THEN ALSO THE HURRICANES. SO WE'RE WORKING TOGETHER WITH MULTIPLE AGENCIES TO GO AHEAD AND ACCOMPLISH THE GOALS.

EDUCATION. WE HAD MEETINGS WITH HOA'S, LARGE LANDOWNERS LIKE RAINIER AND OUR COOPERATORS.

SO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT DEP SO ON.

OUR LANDOWNER AND COOPERATOR COOPERATIVE SERVICES.

WE DO FIRELINE INSULATION. SO A LANDOWNER WILL CALL UP, ASK US TO GO AHEAD AND DO A PRE SUPPRESSION FIRE LINE.

SO WE'LL GO OUT THERE. WE'LL WE'LL PLOW AROUND THAT PRESCRIBED BURNING.

THEY CAN CONTRACT US OR JUST HAVE OUR EQUIPMENT OUT THERE WITH US ON STANDBY.

FUELS MITIGATION. THAT'S WHEN WE GO OUT THERE WITH LIKE A BOBCAT AND WE CAN MOW AN AREA.

NOW WE HAVE TO WORK WITH SAINT JOHNS WATER MANAGEMENT. A LOT OF TIMES IN ORDER TO GO AHEAD SO THAT WE'RE NOT ENCROACHING INTO THE WETLANDS.

AND WE ALSO PROVIDE FOREST MANAGEMENT ADVICE.

SO AT THAT POINT WHEN WE REACH THOSE LANDOWNERS, THAT'S WHEN WE TELL THEM WHEN THEY SHOULD PRESCRIBED BURN, HOW THEY SHOULD PUT IT IN THE FIRE LINES, HOW THEY SHOULD MAINTAIN IT.

AND THEN ON OUR STATE FOREST WE DO THE SAME THING.

SO THAT'S WHY YOU'LL SEE A LOT OF BURNING. LAST WEEK WE WERE BURNING DOWN ON OUR MATANZAS STATE FOREST.

THE CHALLENGES AND THE OUTLOOK THAT WE HAVE GOING INTO THIS SEASON.

OF COURSE, WE'VE ALREADY HEARD A LOT ABOUT THE POPULATION WITH HOW SAINT JOHNS IS GROWING.

THE TRAFFIC IS A CONCERN. IT'S KIND OF HARD TO MANEUVER THOSE LARGE TRUCKS AROUND THE WILDLAND URBAN INTERFACE.

THAT IS THE BIG ISSUE THAT WE HAVE IS BECAUSE AS THESE HOMES ARE BEING PUT IN IN THE BUSINESSES, THEY ARE PUT UP AGAINST THE WETLANDS. I DON'T BLAME THE DEVELOPERS.

I'D BE IN THE SAME BOAT TRYING TO GET THE MOST LAND, THE MOST BUILDINGS ON A PIECE OF LAND.

BUT BY DOING THAT, THEY PUT IT UP TO TO THE SWAMPS, AND THAT'S A PLACE THAT TYPICALLY WE CAN'T GO UNTIL IT'S JUST THAT DRY.

AND WHEN IT REACHES THAT POINT, WE'RE RUNNING A LOT OF FIRES.

THE BUILDING ALLOWANCES, THE CONSERVATION EASEMENTS.

WE TRIED TO REACH OUT TO THE DEVELOPERS AND ASK THEM TO LEAVE A LOT VACANT, WHICH IS THEY'RE GOING TO LOSE MONEY THEN.

SO A LOT OF TIMES THEY DON'T DO IT. AND THAT'S WHY WE DO A LOT OF TRAINING WITH THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, BECAUSE WE CAN'T GET OUR EQUIPMENT BACK TO SOME OF THESE EASEMENTS THAT ARE SURROUNDED BY HOMES.

PRESCRIBED BURNING IS A TOOL. IT IS ONE OF THE MOST COST EFFECTIVE TOOLS THAT WE HAVE.

LAST YEAR IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA, WE BURNED ABOUT A QUARTER MILLION ACRES, WHICH IS A RECORD HIGH FOR US.

BUT COMING WITH BURNING IS A LOT OF SMOKE MANAGEMENT.

WE GET CALLS ALL THE TIME ABOUT THE SMOKE AND HOW IT IMPACTS AND HOW, YOU KNOW, THE SMELL OF IT IS JUST, YOU KNOW, CAUSING ASTHMA TO TRIGGER AND SO ON.

IF WE DON'T PRESCRIBE BURN BECAUSE FLORIDA IS A FIRE REGIME, ITS THE ECOSYSTEMS ARE A FIRE REGIME.

THAT FUEL IS JUST GOING TO CONTINUE TO BUILD AND BUILD.

AND THEN WHEN A WILDFIRE DOES HAPPEN, BECAUSE WE ARE THE LIGHTNING CAPITAL, IT IS GOING TO JUST BE DEVASTATING.

SO BY USING PRESCRIBED BURNING IS AN EXCELLENT TOOL BECAUSE IT CLEARS OUT THAT BRUSH, SOMETHING THAT THEY ARE NOT ABLE TO DO OUT IN CALIFORNIA. SAFETY. SAFETY IS PRIORITY. OUR THE WAY THAT WE APPROACH IT IS THAT WE LOOK TO PROTECT LIFE PROPERTY AND THEN THE TIMBER RESOURCES.

TIMBER IS THE BIGGEST AGRICULTURAL COMMODITY THAT WE HAVE IN THE STATE.

SO BY PROTECTING THOSE THREE THINGS IN ORDER THAT KIND OF GUIDES HOW WE DO IT.

ONE OF THE MOST DISHEARTENING THINGS THAT I'VE HAD TO DO AS A AS A FIREFIGHTER IS GO AHEAD AND SACRIFICE A HOUSE THAT IS VERY HARD TO DO.

THAT WEIGHS HEAVY ON US. THE WEATHER THIS YEAR, WHICH IS KIND OF HARD TO TALK ABOUT NOW WITH IT RAINING.

[01:30:07]

IT WAS PREDICTED FOR ABOVE FIRES FOR JANUARY, FEBRUARY AND MARCH.

THEY ONLY DO A THREE MONTH OUTLOOK SO FAR FOR JANUARY.

IT'S BEEN BELOW AVERAGE FOR US LOCALLY. AND MY EXPERIENCE, MY 13 YEARS HERE, IT'S PROBABLY NOT GOING TO PICK UP UNTIL APRIL AND THEN IN APRIL, THAT'S WHEN WE REALLY START CLAMPING DOWN ON AUTHORIZATIONS THAT WE ISSUE STAGING OUR EQUIPMENT WHERE IT NEEDS TO BE STAGED. AND ALSO JUST GOING BACK REAL QUICK, EVEN THOUGH I HAVE 15 DOZERS HERE, I CAN CALL JACKSONVILLE, WHICH IS ANOTHER DISTRICT, GAINESVILLE.

ORLANDO. I CAN GET MORE DOZERS ANYTIME THAT I NEED THEM.

SO WE'LL SHUFFLE EQUIPMENT AROUND IN THE STATE IN ORDER TO GO AHEAD AND PROTECT THE CITIZENS.

OKAY, SO HOPEFULLY THAT ANSWERS SOME OF THE QUESTIONS.

I KNOW, COMMISSIONER JOSEPH, THAT YOU HAD, AND I HOPE THIS BRINGS SOME EASE TO THE PUBLIC. YOU KNOW HOW WE'RE GOING TO HANDLE THESE SITUATIONS.

THE DEPARTMENT'S READY. THE MEN AND WOMEN OF THIS DEPARTMENT ARE READY. FORESTRY IS READY FOR THESE TYPES OF EVENTS. WE'VE DEALT WITH THEM BEFORE. WE WILL DEAL WITH THEM AGAIN. I'D LIKE TO COMMEND THE BOARD FOR THEIR COMMITMENT TO PUBLIC SAFETY. THE RECENT PUBLIC SAFETY EXPANSION THAT WAS JUST APPROVED RECENTLY IS GOING TO GO A LONG WAY IN HELPING WITH THESE SITUATIONS. IN FACT, THAT PLAN ACTUALLY STARTS TODAY.

IT STARTED AT ZERO 800 THIS MORNING WITH THE CLASS OF 30 FIREFIGHTERS.

THAT JUST STARTED THIS MORNING. THIS IS THEIR FIRST DAY. 21 OF THOSE 30 ARE FROM THE EXPANSION.

SO I APPRECIATE YOUR EFFORTS ON THAT. I ASK FOR YOUR CONTINUED SUPPORT AND FUNDING FOR THE DEPARTMENT, FOR ITS EQUIPMENT, FOR ITS STATIONS AND FOR ITS PERSONNEL.

SO WITH THAT, I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS ANYONE MAY HAVE.

BACK TO THE BOARD. DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? ANY QUESTIONS, MR. MURPHY? GOOD MORNING CHIEF. SIR. THANK YOU GUYS SO MUCH FOR THIS.

PEOPLE FORGET 25 YEARS AGO, IN 1998, WHEN THIS STARTED, I HAPPENED TO BE WORKING AS A TROOPER ON THE INTERSTATE WHEN IT FIRST JUMPED THE INTERSTATE SOUTH OF 207. AND WAS INVOLVED IN THAT HELLISH SUMMER, IF YOU WILL, WHEN I THINK THE ENTIRE COUNTY OF FLAGLER BURNED, WASN'T IT? ALMOST MOST OF SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

SO MY QUESTION WOULD BE THEN, TO EITHER ONE OF YOU IS, WHAT'S THE MAJOR TAKEAWAY FROM THE CHALLENGES THAT CALIFORNIA FOUND THEMSELVES IN? AND WHAT COULD. I THINK YOU'VE ANSWERED THE QUESTION, BUT WHAT'S THE MAJOR TAKEAWAY WITH WITH WITH WHAT THEY'RE GOING THROUGH AND WHAT WE COULD BE POTENTIALLY GOING THROUGH IN A COUPLE OF MONTHS? I THINK SO, LIKE I SAID, CALIFORNIA IS A LOT DIFFERENT. LIKE ANTHONY WAS SAYING, THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO PRESCRIBED BURNING OUT THERE.

HOMEOWNERS ARE NOT ALLOWED TO PREPARE THEIR PROPERTY, CLEAR OUT UNDERBRUSH. SO WHEN THESE FIRES COME THROUGH, THEY'RE LIKE THAT. THEY'RE BURNING RIGHT UP TO THESE HOUSES.

AND, YOU KNOW IT'S A LOT DIFFERENT OUT THERE ESPECIALLY WITH THIS FIRE, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THE WINDS, THE HILLS. SO IF YOU IF YOU TOOK A FLAT PIECE OF PAPER, RIGHT, AND YOU LIGHTED, YOU LET THE CORNER OF THAT PIECE OF PAPER ON FIRE, IT'S GOING TO SLOWLY CREEP ACROSS THAT PIECE OF PAPER, YOU KNOW, AS THE FLAME SPREAD GOES, IF YOU TOOK THAT PIECE OF PAPER AND TILTED IT ON AN ANGLE, LIKE CALIFORNIA, WITH THE MOUNTAINS AND THE TERRAIN OUT THERE, THAT FIRE SPREAD IS GOING TO GROW DRAMATICALLY AND SPREAD FAST UP THAT PIECE, UP THAT PIECE OF PAPER.

SO AS FAR AS WE'RE CONCERNED, I THINK OUR PARTNERSHIPS WITH SURROUNDING AGENCIES, OUR RESOURCE DEPLOYMENT, OUR ABILITY TO TAP INTO THE STATE OF EMERGENCY RESPONSE PLAN AND JUST THE TRAINING AND COOPERATION THAT WE HAVE WITH EACH OTHER.

I THINK WE'RE READY TO GO FOR THESE TYPES OF EVENTS. 98 WAS A LOT DIFFERENT THAN WHERE WE'RE AT TODAY. IN 1998.

WE WERE STRICTLY A VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENT.

THERE WAS NO CAREER FIRE DEPARTMENT AT THAT TIME. WHICH, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, IS WHAT KICKED OFF THE START OF A FULL TIME PROFESSIONAL FIRE FIGHTING DEPARTMENT IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY. THE VOLUNTEERS JUST WERE UNABLE TO GET TO THOSE FIRES IN A TIMELY MANNER, WHICH WHICH, YOU KNOW, CAUSED THEM TO SPREAD LIKE THEY DID.

FORTUNATELY, WITH THE COVERAGE AND THE PERSONNEL AND THE EQUIPMENT WE HAVE NOW TO THIS DAY WE'RE A LOT MORE COVERED.

WE CAN GET THERE A LOT FASTER, A LOT MORE TRAINING, CONSISTENCY IN TRAINING.

SO ANYTHING YOU WANT TO ADD? YEAH. THE ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THAT I HEARD LISTENING ABOUT CALIFORNIA FIRES IS PRIDE BECAME AN ISSUE. LOS ANGELES DIDN'T CALL FOR THE RESOURCES.

WHEN I FIRST STARTED WITH FORESTRY 27 YEARS AGO, IT WAS LIKE THAT.

OUR DISTRICT WAS AN ISLAND, AND WE HAD TO FIGHT FIRE WITH WHAT WE HAD.

THROUGH TIME, THROUGH COOPERATION WITH OUR PARTNERSHIPS EVEN WITHIN THE STATE, JUST OUR OUR DISTRICTS, MY NEIGHBORING DISTRICTS, THOSE WALLS, THOSE FENCES HAVE BEEN BROKEN DOWN.

[01:35:05]

SO WE'RE ABLE TO CALL IN THOSE RESOURCES A LOT FASTER.

SO WE'RE NOT AFRAID TO DO THAT. WE'RE NOT AFRAID TO PICK UP THE PHONE AND CALL THE CHIEF AND SAY, HEY, CAN YOU GET ME, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER. AND THEN HE'LL GO THROUGH HIS CHANNELS TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN.

IF I CAN'T GET THEM FROM FORESTRY SIDE. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.

CHIEF MCGEE, I WAS. EXCUSE ME. I WAS WONDERING YOU KNOW, THE WHOLE WHEN I WAS WATCHING THE MAYOR IN CALIFORNIA ON ON TV, I REALIZED WE DON'T HAVE A MAYOR. WE'RE A COUNTY.

WE HAVE THE COMMISSIONERS. AND I WAS WONDERING, DO YOU GIVE THE ADMINISTRATOR UPDATES ON THE WEATHER WHEN YOU YOU SAID EVERY WEEK OR EVERY DAY YOU CHECK THE WEATHER TO SEE FIRE HAZARD AND WHATNOT? I DON'T BELIEVE MISS ANDREWS RECEIVES THE FIRE WEATHER UPDATES. IT'D BE EASY JUST TO ADD HER. IT'S AN EMAIL UPDATE THAT GOES ACROSS THE DEPARTMENT. WE COULD ADD TO THAT LIST, AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT SO THAT WE'RE PREPARED AND WE'RE PROACTIVE INSTEAD OF REACTIVE.

ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. YES. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

I LEARNED A LOT. I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU, BUT I THOUGHT THAT WAS FANTASTIC.

THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT. WE'RE ON AGENDA ITEM TWO.

018. I'M SORRY. YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. WE ADDED ONE A FROM CONSENT AGENDA NUMBER 14.

[14. Motion to adopt Resolution 2025-_____, authorizing the County Administrator, or designee, to issue a non-exclusive franchise agreement to Hicks Rolloff and Recycling, LLC, for the collection and transportation of non-residential solid waste, of the type specified in the agreement. For more information, contact Greg Caldwell, Public Works Director at 904 209-0266]

NON EXCLUSIVE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT TO THE ROLL OFF AND RECYCLING LLC.

GOOD MORNING. COMMISSIONERS GREG CALDWELL SAINT JOHNS COUNTY PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR. THIS ITEM IS THE AUTHORIZATION TO ISSUE A NON EXCLUSIVE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT TO HICKS ROLL-OFF AND RECYCLING FOR THE COLLECTION AND TRANSPORTATION OF NON RESIDENTIAL SOLID WASTE.

SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY WE HAVE DIFFERENT FIRMS THAT PROVIDE COLLECTION OF THIS CONSTRUCTION AND DEBRIS TRANSPORTED EITHER INTERNALLY INTO THE COUNTY OR OUTSIDE OF THE COUNTY. BUT WE HAVE THIS AGREEMENT THAT MAKES SURE THAT THEY FOLLOW THE REGULATIONS AND THE GUIDELINES THAT THEY'RE NOT IMPACTING AND ADHERING TO ALL STATE REGULATIONS. THIS ALSO GENERATES SOME REVENUE FOR SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

THIS HELPS OFFSET SOME OF OUR IMPACTS TO THE INFRASTRUCTURE ON ROADS.

WE ACTUALLY PUT 50% OF THE REVENUE BACK INTO THE ROAD SEGMENTS OF SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

THE OTHER PORTION GOES INTO OUR SOLID WASTE ACCOUNT TO KEEP SUPPORTING OUR RESIDENTIAL COLLECTION.

WE HAVE APPROXIMATELY 40 TO 50 OF THESE AGREEMENTS IN PLACE TO DATE.

OUR SOLID WASTE ORDINANCE MAKES IT COME BACK IN FRONT OF THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS FOR APPROVAL. SO YOU WILL SEE THESE USUALLY EVERY COUPLE OF MONTHS YOU'LL SEE ANOTHER ONE.

COME ON. BUT WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE HERE UNTIL ALL THE GUIDELINES.

COMMISSIONER MURPHY. DO YOU HAVE A QUESTION? I DO, I HAD SOME THINGS COME UP AFTER THIS HIT THE THE AIRWAVES, IF YOU WILL, ABOUT 13.13, WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THE PERCENTAGE.

LET ME FIND IT REAL QUICK. I'LL READ IT TO YOU.

THE FAIR DEALINGS WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THAT. NO COUNTY COMMISSIONER OR COUNTY OFFICER OR COUNTY EMPLOYEE DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY OWNS MORE THAN 5% OF THE TOTAL ASSETS OF THE CAPITAL STOCK OF THE CONTRACTOR.

YES. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THIS AND MAYBE YOU CAN HELP ME OUT WITH THIS.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THIS IS JUST A GENERAL STATEMENT THAT IS PUT IN A LOT OF CONTRACTS, BUT I'M GOING TO DEFER TO LEGAL TO HELP. WELL, IF I CAN I CAN TELL YOU THAT I DON'T OWN ANY STOCK IN ANYBODY IN ANY OF THIS, BUT I THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT WE COULD EASILY FIX OR REMOVE AS A REQUIREMENT TO HAVE.

THIS SHOULDN'T HAVE ANY. SO THROUGH THE CHAIR TO COMMISSIONER MURPHY, THAT LANGUAGE IN THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT DIRECTLY TRACKS STATUTORY LANGUAGE WITH REGARD TO MATERIAL INTEREST AND RELEVANT TO THE FLORIDA CONFLICT OF INTEREST LAWS, WHICH IS FOUND IN CHAPTER 112.

THAT'S REQUESTING DISCLOSURE FROM THE COMPANY. PUBLIC OFFICERS, EMPLOYEES SUBJECT TO CHAPTER 112 ALSO HAVE A DISCLOSURE REQUIREMENT.

SO WE'RE JUST TRACKING THE STATUTORY LANGUAGE IN THERE.

OKAY. THANKS. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? COMMISSIONER MURPHY? YOU KNOW, I'M YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I'M TRYING TO DO IS MAKE SURE THAT I HAVE ALL THE I HAVE THE THE PAUL HARVEY, IF YOU WILL, THE THE REST OF THE STORY ABOUT THIS.

I'M WOULD LOVE TO HAVE THIS, THAT WE NOT HAVE ANY OWNERSHIP OF ANYTHING THAT'S DOING ANYTHING WITH THE COUNTY.

I DON'T KNOW IF IF WE CAN DO THAT, IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT I CAN ASK STAFF TO CHECK ON.

WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING WE COULD DO? COULD WE CHECK ON REMOVING THIS FROM IT? I DON'T I DON'T MIND GOING FORWARD WITH THIS PROVISION IN THERE, BUT I JUST FEEL A LITTLE, A LITTLE WONKY ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF SOMEONE WHO COULD VOTE ON SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAVING ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CONTRACT.

SO, SO AGAIN, THROUGH THE CHAIR TO COMMISSIONER MURPHY, YOU THIS DOESN'T ABSOLVE YOU OF YOUR REQUIREMENT TO DISCLOSE ANY INTEREST IN A COMPANY

[01:40:09]

BEFORE THE BOARD THAT'S UNDER CONTRACT. SO YOU STILL HAVE THAT OBLIGATION SO TO CERTAIN EMPLOYEES.

BUT YOU CAN CERTAINLY MAKE THE PROVISION MORE RESTRICTIVE.

WOULD HE MAKE A MOTION THEN A TYPE OF MOTION OR SO.

IS THE INTENT TO JUST MAKE IT FOR THIS CONTRACT.

WELL, AND HERE AGAIN I WOULD PROBABLY NEED SOME MORE EXPERTISE ABOUT THIS.

MY MY PREFERENCE WOULD BE TO MAKE IT FOR EVERY COUNTY CONTRACT.

BUT I KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT MORE TO IT THAN JUST JUST WAVING A MAGIC WAND AT IT.

AND I REALLY WANT TO GET ALL THE INFORMATION. SO COULD WE YOU KNOW, POSSIBLY DIRECT THE STAFF TO LOOK AT LIMITING THIS IN FUTURE CONTRACTS? WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING THAT WE COULD DO? IS THAT IS THAT IS THAT A REASONABLE REQUEST? THAT IS OKAY. I'M NOT NECESSARILY SAYING THAT WE NEED TO HOLD THIS UP, BUT I THINK GOING FORWARD, WE NEED TO RESOLVE THIS TO MY SATISFACTION. SO, COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST.

THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. COMMISSIONER. I GUESS I'M NOT SURE WHERE THE WHERE THE CONCERN IS COMING FROM. YOUR CONCERN THAT COMMISSIONERS MAY NOW OR IN THE FUTURE HAVE OWNERSHIP STAKE IN ONE OF THE CONTRACTS THAT COME BEFORE THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS? YES. AND YOU WANT TO MAKE THE THE LANGUAGE A LITTLE MORE RESTRICTIVE OR MORE CLEAR ABOUT WHO CAN OR CAN'T. YES, SIR. OWN STAKE. I WOULD LIKE TO FURTHER INVESTIGATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT.

YES. OKAY. I MEAN, I YEAH, I'VE NEVER OBVIOUSLY, Y'ALL KNOW I'M IN THE JEWELRY BUSINESS.

I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY JEWELRY COMING BEFORE THE BOARD. IT DOESN'T IMPACT ME AT ALL.

I JUST I'LL SUPPORT ANY LANGUAGE THAT COULD MAKE IT MORE RESTRICTIVE.

I DON'T SEE THAT AS A CURRENT ISSUE THAT WE THAT WE FACE. AND IT'S NOT JUST PROCESSING.

IT'S NOT. IT JUST KIND OF FEELS WEIRD THAT THE PUBLIC WOULD, THAT WE WOULD VOTE ON SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD HAVE A FINANCIAL STAKE IN AS A, AS A COMPANY. I KNOW I'M IN THE BARBECUE BUSINESS.

I DON'T WANT TO PRECLUDE MYSELF FROM GETTING A CONTRACT WITH THE COUNTY TO FEED PEOPLE, BUT BUT I WOULD RECUSE MYSELF AS A COMMISSIONER FROM DOING THAT BECAUSE IT JUST DIDN'T SEEM PROPER THAT I WOULD DO THAT. SO I GUESS FOR ME, IT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, CAN WE GO BACK? IS THERE SOMETHING I'M MISSING? IS SOMETHING I DON'T UNDERSTAND ABOUT CHANGING THIS GOING FORWARD. SO, COMMISSIONER MURPHY, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, I'D BE HAPPY TO TAKE A LOOK AT SOME LANGUAGE.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE CAN BRING THIS BACK FOR A VOTE IF YOU WANT TO DRAFT SOME LANGUAGE.

ABSOLUTELY. SO WE HAVE A CONSENSUS ON THAT, RIGHT? I JUST WANTED COMMISSIONER TAYLOR. YEAH, I DON'T THINK IT'S JUST COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, THOUGH. IT SAYS COUNTY COMMISSIONERS AND COUNTY STAFF.

THAT'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THAT'S A LOT OF EMPLOYEES THAT COULD HAVE SOME KIND OF.

SO IT'S NOT JUST THIS DOESN'T JUST TIE TO COUNTY COMMISSIONERS, IT'S ALL STAFF.

SO I THINK THAT'S WHAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S MORE THAN JUST THE THE FIVE OF US UP HERE OR IN THE FUTURE WHO WOULD BE UP HERE.

SO DO WE APPROVE THIS OR NOT APPROVE THIS? I'M NOT SURE WHERE WE ARE WITH THAT.

I WILL SAY, COMMISSIONERS, WE PROBABLY HAVE 40 TO 40 PLUS CONTRACTS LIKE THIS WITH THIS LANGUAGE CURRENTLY IN IT.

THESE CONTRACTS RUN THROUGH 2027. THE CURRENT ONES, WE CAN REEVALUATE THAT AS WE COME UP TO THE NEW 2027, TO MAKE SURE IT HAS THE APPROPRIATE LANGUAGE THAT THE BOARD WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN FUTURE.

I WOULD BE AMENABLE TO THAT, AND I WOULD ALSO I WOULDN'T MIND GOING AHEAD AND PASSING IT AS IS SO WE COULD GET WORK DONE FOR THE COUNTY, BUT WE NEED TO ROLL BACK AND MAKE SURE THAT WE TAKE A LOOK AT THIS IN THE FUTURE FOR FUTURE CONTRACTS.

SO DO WE HAVE A MOTION THEN? LET'S SEE. YES, MA'AM.

I DO HAVE A MOTION. OKAY. I HAVE A MOTION TO ADOPT RESOLUTION.

RESOLUTION 2025 DASH 26, AUTHORIZING THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR, OR DESIGNEE TO ISSUE A NON-EXCLUSIVE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT TO THE HICKS, ROLL-OFF AND RECYCLING, LLC FOR THE COLLECTION AND TRANSPORTATION OF NONRESIDENTIAL SOLID WASTE OF THE TYPE SPECIFIED IN THE AGREEMENT.

SECOND. ALL RIGHT, LET'S VOTE. DO WE NEED TO HEAR PUBLIC? DO WE NEED PUBLIC COMMENT ON THAT? OKAY. AT THIS TIME WE HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER ONE A.

SUZANNE CLULOW. 109 LAUREL WOOD WAY. 32086. INTERESTING POINT, COMMISSIONER.

I THINK YOU DO HAVE A POINT. I MEAN, THE MORE I'M SITTING THERE THINKING ABOUT THIS.

BUT I APPRECIATE MISS TAYLOR BRINGING UP THAT.

IT ALSO SAYS EMPLOYEES, WHICH THEN IT LEADS ME UP ANOTHER TRAIL.

TO ME, IT NEEDS TO BE THE DECISION MAKERS. THE PEOPLE THAT ARE MAKING THE DECISIONS SHOULDN'T HAVE A CONFLICT OF INTEREST.

[01:45:04]

ALL THE EMPLOYEES THAT WE HAVE WORKING FOR US, WHETHER THEY'RE A CLERK THAT PROCESSES INVOICES, WHO MAY HAVE AN INVESTMENT ACCOUNT THAT MAY HAVE WASTE MANAGEMENT, OR I DON'T KNOW, SOMEBODY IN THEIR PORTFOLIO.

I THINK THAT'S GOING A BIT TOO FAR. BUT THIS DID GET PULLED OFF OF THE CONSENT AGENDA.

I WOULD LIKE TO JUST THROW IT OUT THERE. HE I BELIEVE MR. CALDWELL SAID. HOW MANY CONTRACTS? 40, 60. 40 PLUS.

40 PLUS CONTRACTS. PUT THEM ON THE REGULAR AGENDA, HOPEFULLY GROUPED TOGETHER IN GROUPS OF TEN OR SOMETHING.

SO WE'RE NOT SITTING HERE FOREVER. BUT THEN YOU, THE PUBLIC GETS TO HEAR YOU GET TO MAKE THE DECISION AND YOU WOULD DISCLOSE ANY TYPES OF THINGS YOU NEED TO DISCLOSE AND DECIDE WHETHER TO VOTE OR NOT TO VOTE.

IN TODAY'S WORLD, THERE'S SO MUCH GOING ON. EVERYTHING'S DONE ELECTRONICALLY.

HALF THE TIME, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE PAYING FOR, WHAT YOU'RE.

BECAUSE IT'S AUTO EVERYTHING. I THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA.

PARTICULARLY, SOME OF THESE CONTRACTS ARE PRETTY LARGE TO JUST PAUSE FOR A MOMENT.

LOOK AT THE ACTUAL NUMBERS ON AN AGENDA ITEM AND VOTE AND MAKE ANY DISCLOSURES.

AND I THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA TO PURSUE AND I LOOK FORWARD TO THE DISCUSSION.

THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM ONE? SEEING NONE, WE'LL CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT. SO DO WE VOTE AGAIN OR WE JUST ADD ONE? CAN WE HAVE THAT GO DOWN THEN. ALL RIGHT SO THERE'S A MOTION ON THE TABLE.

LET'S VOTE. THAT PASSES FIVE ZERO.

MR. COMMANDO. WHEN WOULD THAT THE NEW LANGUAGE.

WHEN SHOULD WE LOOK FOR THAT ON THE AGENDA OR CONSENT AGENDA IN THE FUTURE? WHY DON'T YOU LET US TAKE A LOOK AND THEN DISCUSS WITH EACH OF YOU INDIVIDUALLY KIND OF WHAT THE LAW SAYS AND WHAT YOUR OPTIONS ARE, AND THEN WE CAN GET FEEDBACK FROM YOU AS TO WHAT YOU WANT TO SEE MOVING FORWARD.

ABOUT HOW LONG WILL THAT TAKE? I JUST, YOU KNOW, WE'LL DO THIS AND THEN SIX MONTHS DOWN THE ROAD, WE'LL, YOU KNOW, I JUST WANT TO KNOW IT'S COMING UP SOON.

WE CAN DO IT UP BEFORE THE NEXT MEETING. OKAY.

GREAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ANYTHING ELSE? ALL RIGHT, LET'S GO TO AGENDA ITEM NUMBER TWO.

[2. St. Johns County Impact Fee Update Study. Presentation of required 5-year review of St. Johns County Impact Fees. Seeking direction for staff to pursue changes to the Impact Fee Schedule.]

IMPACT FEES. GOOD MORNING, MADAM CHAIR. GOOD MORNING, COMMISSIONERS MIKE ROBERTSON, GROWTH MANAGEMENT DIRECTOR.

I HOPE EVERYONE HAD A GOOD HOLIDAY. WE HAVE THE SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY IMPACT FEE UPDATE.

THAT IS AN UPDATE THAT IS REQUIRED BY THE COUNTY ORDINANCE.

IT SAYS ASK THE COMMISSIONERS TO REVIEW THE COUNTY IMPACT FEES ABOUT EVERY FIVE YEARS.

TAKE A LOOK AT IT. WITHIN THERE YOU'LL HAVE THE ABILITY TO LOOK AT WHAT OUR CONSULTANT PROVIDES.

IS THE HIGHEST TECHNICALLY DEFENSIBLE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO DECREASING IMPACT FEES.

RIGHT. THAT'S THE RANGE HERE. THIS MEETING IS NOT TO APPROVE THIS.

THIS IS THE FIRST MEETING. THIS MEETING IS INFORMATIONAL AND ULTIMATELY FOR STAFF TO GET DIRECTION FROM THE COMMISSION ON WHICH WAY TO GO.

OKAY. SO WE WILL HAVE ADDITIONAL MEETINGS FOR THOSE PAYING ATTENTION BECAUSE IT IS AN ORDINANCE.

ORDINANCES REQUIRE PUBLIC INPUT AND FEEDBACK.

SO AT THE END, MAYBE AFTER NILGUN CAMP, WHO IS OUR CONSULTANT AND PRINCIPAL FOR NASH, AFTER SHE GIVES HER PRESENTATION, WE'LL COME BACK UP AND LOOK FOR SOME FEEDBACK AND HAVE YOU CAN ASK QUESTIONS.

THIS IS A LONG PRESENTATION, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE.

THIS IS A LOT OF COMPLICATED INFORMATION AND IT'S IMPORTANT.

SO WITH THAT, I'LL LEAVE IT TO MISS NILGUN CAMP.

THANK YOU. GOOD MORNING, COMMISSIONERS. FOR THE RECORD.

IS IT. OH, THERE IT IS. OKAY. SORRY. OKAY. PRESENTATION GOES THROUGH A LITTLE BIT OF THE BACKGROUND ABOUT IMPACT FEES AND THE STUDY, AND THEN GETS INTO THE TECHNICAL CALCULATIONS AND NEXT STEPS.

SO THIS IS NOTHING YOU DON'T KNOW. BUT SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY IS GROWING RAPIDLY.

WHEN WE LOOK AT ALL 67 FLORIDA COUNTIES, YOU RANK SECOND IN TERMS OF THE GROWTH PROJECTED GROWTH RATE THROUGH 2050.

AND YOUR RESIDENTIAL PERMITTING LEVELS ARE AT THEIR HIGHEST SINCE 1990.

SO ALL THAT IS, OF COURSE, PUTTING PRESSURE ON SERVICES AND INFRASTRUCTURE.

THE COUNTY ADOPTED SEVERAL IMPACT FEES AND THESE WERE LAST UPDATED IN 2018.

[01:50:07]

SO THE PURPOSE OF THE STUDY IS TO UPDATE INPUT VARIABLES LIKE EXPLAIN ON A ROUTINE BASIS.

ALSO, THIS STUDY DEVELOPS A CONSERVATION IMPACT FEE FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.

AND AGAIN, THE UPDATE OF THESE VARIABLES IS ONE OF THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS.

SO IMPACT FEES BY DEFINITION ARE ONE TIME CAPITAL CHARGE TO NEW DEVELOPMENT.

THEY COVER THE COST OF NEW CAPITAL FACILITIES.

SO THEY CAN ONLY BE USED FOR CAPACITY EXPANSION.

ADDITIONAL CAPITAL PROJECTS. THEY CANNOT BE USED FOR MAINTENANCE OPERATIONS.

THAT KIND OF RENOVATIONS. BUT THEY DO FREE UP GENERAL TAX DOLLARS BY TAKING CARE OF THE CAPACITY PROJECTS.

SO THEY HELP THE OTHER PROGRAMS INDIRECTLY. THEY HELP IMPLEMENT THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLANS.

AND THEY ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT THAN TAXES IN THAT THEY NEED TO BE BASED ON THE IMPACT OF THE DEVELOPMENT IMPACT OF EACH LAND USE, NOT THE VALUE, NOT WHAT THEY CAN PAY, BUT HOW MUCH THEY ARE AFFECTING IN EACH INFRASTRUCTURE TYPE.

THEIR MAIN PURPOSE IS TO MAINTAIN THE LEVEL OF SERVICE.

THEY CALCULATE THE COST OF GROWTH, AND THEY ARE MOST NEEDED WHEN THERE ARE HIGH GROWTH LEVELS AND LIMITED ALTERNATIVE FUNDING.

SO IMPACT FEES IN FLORIDA WERE GOVERNED BY CASE LAW FOR A LONG TIME.

AND THEN IN 2006, WE HAD THE IMPACT FEE ACT PASSED.

AND SINCE THEN IT HAS SEVERAL CHANGES. SOME OF ITS KEY REQUIREMENTS INCLUDE THAT THE FEES BE BASED ON MOST RECENT AND LOCALIZED DATA. THERE IS IF THERE IS AN INCREASE, THERE IS A MINIMUM OF 90 DAY NOTICE REQUIREMENT IF THERE IS A CHALLENGE.

NOW THE GOVERNMENT HAS THE BURDEN OF SHOWING THAT THEIR FEES ARE CORRECT.

IT USED TO BE THE OTHER WAY AROUND. THE OTHER SIDE HAD TO SHOW YOU SOMETHING WAS INCORRECT.

AND THEN THERE ARE SEVERAL OTHER REQUIREMENTS.

SO IN 2021 WE HAD THE HOUSE BILL 337 PASSED. AND IT PUT SOME LIMITS ON HOW MUCH WE CAN INCREASE THE FEES AS WELL AS PHASING THOSE INCREASES.

SO IF THE FEES ARE THESE ARE INCREASING UP TO 25%.

THEY NEED TO BE INCREASED OVER TWO YEARS. IF THEY ARE INCREASING BETWEEN 25 TO 50%, THEN THEY NEED TO BE INCREASED OVER FOUR INSTALLMENTS.

THEY CANNOT BE INCREASED MORE THAN 50% AND THEY CANNOT BE INCREASED MORE THAN ONCE EVERY FOUR YEARS.

THERE IS AN EXCEPTION CLAUSE THAT, IF THE JURISDICTION DEMONSTRATES EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES, HOLDS TWO PUBLIC WORKSHOPS TO DISCUSS THOSE CIRCUMSTANCES AND THE INCREASE IS APPROVED BY TWO THIRDS OF THE GOVERNING BODY, THEN IT COULD BE MORE THAN 50%, OR IT WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE THAT LIMIT.

AND SEVERAL JURISDICTIONS USE THAT. AND WHAT THEY SHOWED WAS THAT THEY WERE EXPERIENCING HIGH GROWTH LEVELS, THE COSTS WERE INCREASING SIGNIFICANTLY, AND THEY HAD A LIST OF PROJECTS.

THOSE ARE THE PRIMARY ITEMS THEY SHOWED FOR THAT.

THEN THIS YEAR WE HAD HOUSE BILL 479 79 PASS.

IT PUTS A REQUIREMENT OF INTERLOCAL AGREEMENTS IF A IF BOTH THE CITY AND THE COUNTY COLLECTING FOR TRANSPORTATION IMPACTS WITHIN THE MUNICIPALITY, AND THEN IT ALSO REQUIRED THAT THE STUDIES BE COMPLETED AND ADOPTED IN 12 MONTHS.

AND ALSO THEY NEED TO USE DATA AVAILABLE WITHIN THE PAST FOUR YEARS.

SO TECHNICAL STUDY IS USING A CONSUMPTION BASED METHODOLOGY, WHICH IS VERY COMMON IN FLORIDA.

IT CHARGES NEW GROWTH BASED ON THE VALUE OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT IT'S USING.

SO FEES ARE CALCULATED AT A RATE THAT THEY CANNOT CORRECT EXISTING DEFICIENCIES.

AND THAT'S ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS. WE CANNOT CHARGE NEW DEVELOPMENT AT A RATE TO CORRECT EXISTING DEFICIENCIES AND CONSUMPTION BASED METHODOLOGY.

BASICALLY THE WAY IT'S CALCULATED, MAKE SURE THAT THAT IS THE CASE.

WE ALONE COMPLETED PROBABLY 400 500 STUDIES OVER THE PAST 30 YEARS USING THIS METHODOLOGY.

IT HAS NEVER BEEN CHALLENGED SUCCESSFULLY. AND ALSO THAT'S ALSO YOUR ADOPTED METHODOLOGY AS WELL.

SO THE BASIC IMPACT FEE FORMULA LOOKS AT COST TO ADD CAPACITY.

SO THAT'S THE VALUE OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THE COUNTY.

AND THEN WE REVIEW ANY OTHER FUNDING SOURCES THAT COUNTY ALLOCATES FOR CAPACITY PROJECTS.

SO TO THE EXTENT THAT COUNTY IS USING TAXES A PORTION OF IT WILL COME FROM NEW DEVELOPMENT.

SO WE WANT TO CREDIT THAT SO THAT WE ARE NOT CHARGING THEM ONCE FOR THE IMPACT FEE, ONCE FOR THE TAX FOR THE SAME INFRASTRUCTURE, AND THEN THAT NET COST GETS MULTIPLIED BY DEMAND, WHICH IS MEASURED IN TERMS OF TRAVEL FOR TRANSPORTATION AND POPULATION FOR THE OTHER FEES.

[01:55:01]

SO THE THERE ARE SEVERAL COMPONENTS IN THE STUDY THE INVENTORY, YOUR LEVEL OF SERVICE AND COST COMPONENT THAT ALL THAT COMBINED MEASURES NEW GROWTH COSTS CREDIT AGAIN IT'S NEW GROWTH CONTRIBUTION TO OTHER REVENUE SOURCES.

AND THEN THE DEMAND MEASURES IMPACT OF EACH LAND USE IN EACH ON EACH SERVICE AREA.

SO I WILL GO THROUGH IN A LITTLE BIT IN MORE DETAILS IN THE PUBLIC BUILDINGS CASE.

AND THEN YOU'LL SEE THERE'S A PATTERN UNTIL WE GET TO TRANSPORTATION WHICH IS CALCULATED A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY.

SO IN THE INTEREST OF TIME, I WILL ONLY SHOW DETAILS FOR PUBLIC BUILDINGS.

AND, AND THEN IF YOU NEED IT, WE CAN GET INTO THEM AFTERWARDS.

SO THE PUBLIC BUILDINGS, THE INVENTORY INCLUDES GENERAL GOVERNMENT FACILITIES, COURT FACILITIES AND SO ON.

AND THERE'S A TOTAL OF ABOUT ALMOST 715,000FT² AND 200 ACRES OF LAND.

WHEN WE ESTIMATE THE COST, HOW MUCH WHAT THE WHAT IS THE VALUE OF THIS INVENTORY WE ARE LOOKING AT WHAT WOULD IT COST TO BUILD THOSE FACILITIES TODAY? SO TO DO THAT WE REVIEW ANY RECENT CONSTRUCTION COUNTY HAS MADE COMPLETED AND THEN ANY BIDS.

SO THAT'S OUR LOCAL DATA. WE SUPPLEMENT THAT FROM DATA FROM OTHER FLORIDA JURISDICTIONS FOR SIMILAR TYPE FACILITIES.

SO IN THIS CASE, THE PRIMARY BUILDINGS WERE ESTIMATED TO COST ABOUT $500 PER SQUARE FOOT, SPORT BUILDINGS $250 PER SQUARE FOOT. IN THE CASE OF LAND, WE FOLLOWED A SIMILAR PROCESS.

WE LOOK AT ANYTHING THE COUNTY PURCHASED RECENTLY.

IF THERE ARE ANY APPRAISALS, ESTIMATES FOR UPCOMING PURCHASES, AND ALSO REVIEW VACANT LAND SALES THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY FOR SIMILAR SIZE ACRES.

SO WITH THAT ANALYSIS, IT WAS ESTIMATED AT 150,000 PER ACRE ON AVERAGE FOR PUBLIC BUILDINGS.

LEVEL OF SERVICE IS MEASURED IN TERMS OF SQUARE FOOTAGE PER POPULATION, SO THAT'S ABOUT 2.15.

SO THE TOTAL VALUE OF THE ASSETS IS ABOUT 375 MILLION.

THAT DIVIDED BY POPULATION GIVES US ABOUT $100 PER PERSON.

AND THAT REPRESENTS THE INVESTMENT COMMUNITY HAS MADE UP TO THIS POINT INTO PUBLIC BUILDINGS, INFRASTRUCTURE. THAT'S SORT OF OUR STARTING POINT TO CHARGE NEW DEVELOPMENT.

THIS IS WHAT WE INVESTED. YOU KNOW, WE'D LIKE YOU TO CONTRIBUTE AT THAT RATE.

WE THEN REVIEW WHAT OTHER FUNDING SOURCES ARE CONTRIBUTING TO CAPACITY PROJECTS.

SO COUNTY IS USING FUNDS FROM GENERAL FUND TREEBANK BUILDING SERVICES FUND GRANTS AND SO ON.

SO THAT AMOUNTS ABOUT 2.4 MILLION PER YEAR ON AVERAGE.

THERE'S ALSO DEBT SERVICE, OUTSTANDING DEBT SERVICE ASSOCIATED WITH SEVERAL CAPACITY PROJECTS.

SO AGAIN A PORTION WILL COME FROM FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.

SO WE AGAIN TAKE THE TOTAL COST OF THAT 1100, AND THE CREDIT IS ABOUT $184, AND THE NET COST IS.

THE DIFFERENCE IS ABOUT $940 PER PERSON. AND THAT $940 PER PERSON IS MULTIPLIED BY RESIDENTS PER UNIT FOR EACH LAND USE. YOUR YOUR FULL FEE SCHEDULE HAS A MUCH LARGER SET OF LAND USES.

THESE ARE JUST SAMPLE LAND USES. SO YOU CAN KIND OF SEE FOR 1300 SQUARE FOOT, IT ENDS UP BEING ABOUT $1,500 ALMOST FOR A 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOME IS ABOUT 1650. AND THEN THE NONRESIDENTIAL IS PER 1000 SQUARE FOOT AND VARIES DEPENDING ON THE LAND USE.

SO THIS CHART SHOWS YOU WHAT THE CURRENT IMPACT FEE IS.

AND THEN THE WHAT'S THE CALCULATED IMPACT FEE IS.

IN THIS CASE, SEVERAL LAND USES ARE EXCEEDING THAT 50% THRESHOLD.

SO TO GET TO GET TO THE FULL CALCULATED FEE SCHEDULE WOULD REQUIRE THAT DEMONSTRATION OF THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES.

AND THEN THE VERY LAST COLUMN SHOWS YOU WHAT IS THE MAXIMUM ALLOWED WITHOUT THAT CLAUSE.

AND THEN YOU CAN KIND OF SEE. SO 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOME, INSTEAD OF GOING FROM 840 TO 1600 IT WOULD BE CAPPED AT 1260. SO IN THE CASE OF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND CORRECTIONAL FACILITIES CURRENT FEES AGAIN FOR RESIDENTIAL MIDSIZE IS ABOUT 390 PER HOME, THAT THE CALCULATED FULL FEE IS ABOUT 850, AND THE MAXIMUM ALLOWABLE FEE IS 590. ALMOST.

FIRE RESCUE. CURRENT FEES. ABOUT. AGAIN, I'M USING THE 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOME AS AN EXAMPLE, 730 CALCULATED FEE IS ABOUT 780 AND THAT'S LESS THAN A 50% INCREASE.

[02:00:03]

SO THEN WE CAN IMPLEMENT THAT AT 780. PARKS AND RECREATION AGAIN MID-SIZE 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOME. CURRENTLY THE FEE IS ABOUT ALMOST 1700.

THAT WOULD GO TO 2470. AND BECAUSE THAT'S LESS THAN 50% INCREASE IT COULD BE IMPLEMENTED AT 2470. OKAY. SO TRANSPORTATION IS CALCULATED A LITTLE DIFFERENTLY.

SO I KIND OF WOULD LIKE TO WALK YOU THROUGH THE FORMULA.

SO WE START WITH ESTIMATING THE COST OF ONE LANE MILE OF ROADWAY.

SO THIS IS ESTIMATED AT 5.6 MILLION. BASICALLY THAT SAYS IF YOU HAVE ONE MILE OF ROADWAY WITH TWO LANES IT'S ABOUT 11 MILLION. THAT ROAD CARRIES A CAPACITY OF 16,000.

SO THE COST PER PERSON MILES OF CAPACITY IS $350.

WHAT THAT SAYS EVERY TIME WE ADD A PERSON TO THE ROADWAY SYSTEM FOR THEM TO TRAVEL A MILE IS COSTING THAT INFRASTRUCTURE $350.

SORT OF A UNIT COST. AN AVERAGE HOME GENERATES 32 PERSON MILES OF TRAVEL.

SO THE TOTAL IMPACT COST IS THOSE TWO. MULTIPLY 11,200.

WE THEN HAVE A CREDIT OF 1800 BECAUSE OF THE OTHER FUNDING SOURCES.

SO THE NET FEE ENDS UP BEING THE DIFFERENCE IS 9400.

SO JUST TO GIVE YOU A SENSE HOW THE FORMULA WORKS.

SO IN TERMS OF THE COST COMPONENT WE HAD YOU KNOW, WE HAD THE THIS IS THIS CHART IS SHOWING THE TRENDS GOING BACK TO LATE 90S. YOU CAN KIND OF SEE THAT 2000 456 WE HAD WE HAD THE BOOM.

THE COST INCREASED SIGNIFICANTLY. THEN WE HIT THE GREAT RECESSION.

COST DECREASED. AND THEN AFTER THAT, AFTER 20 1213, COSTS WERE INCREASING SOMEWHAT STEADILY.

THEN WE HAD THE PANDEMIC AND THAT LEVEL OF INCREASE HEIGHTENED AFTER THE PANDEMIC.

AND WE ARE KIND OF SEEING THAT WHEN WE LOOK AT DIFFERENT INDICES AS WELL.

AGAIN, YOU SEE A MUCH SHARPER INCREASE SINCE 2000 OVER THE LAST YEAR THAT STARTED GETTING MODERATED.

WE STILL HAVE AN INCREASE, BUT IT'S NOT AS SHARP.

IT'S KIND OF SOFTENING. SO THE COST COMPONENT AGAIN STARTS WITH THE LOCAL DATA SINCE WE HAVE TO USE RECENT AND LOCALIZED DATA.

THESE ARE 2324 PROJECTS. THEY AVERAGE ABOUT 3.1 MILLION PER LANE MILE.

WE ALSO REVIEW PROJECTS FROM OTHER COUNTIES. THEY AVERAGE ABOUT 2.9.

AND MORE RECENT PROJECTS LIKE SINCE 20 ALSO FOR OTHER COUNTIES, RIGHT AT 3.1, SO WE USE 3.1 MILLION PER LANE MILE FOR COUNTY ROADWAY. CONSTRUCTION COSTS ONLY. WE HAVE A SIMILAR ANALYSIS FOR STATE ROADWAYS, AND THAT GIVES US ABOUT 5 MILLION PER LANE MILE.

AND THEN WHEN WE ADD RIGHT AWAY DESIGN CI, ENVIRONMENTAL COSTS AND BLEND COUNTY AND STATE COSTS BASED ON THE PROJECTS IN YOUR LONG RANGE TRANSPORTATION PLAN. OVERALL WEIGHTED AVERAGE ENDS UP BEING 5.6 MILLION PER LANE MILE.

THAT IS DIVIDED BY THE CAPACITY THAT IT ADDS ON A VEHICLE MILES BASIS GIVES US FIVE.

$565. ON THE REVENUE SIDE, WE ARE LOOKING AT, AGAIN REVENUES FROM ALL SOURCES FOR THE TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM, COUNTY, STATE AND SO ON. SO THAT'S ON AN ANNUAL BASIS GENERATING ABOUT 34 MILLION.

SO WITH THAT COST AND CREDIT, THE FEE ENDS UP BEING FOR A SMALL HOME.

CURRENT FEE IS 8486. IT HAS A DECREASE TO 8416.

MIDSIZE FROM 10,500 TO 9400. AND THEN THERE ARE INCREASES IN THE NONRESIDENTIAL LAND USES.

AND I KNOW THERE WERE CONCERNS ABOUT THE DECREASE.

SO I JUST WANT TO EXPLAIN WHAT ARE THE REALLY THE TWO VARIABLES MAKING THE MOST IMPACT ON THAT.

ONE IS INTERSTATE TRAVEL. WE EXCLUDE INTERSTATE TRAVEL FROM THE CALCULATIONS, WHICH IS VERY STANDARD JUST BECAUSE INTERSTATES ARE BUILT WITH LARGE FEDERAL GRANTS. NOT WITH IMPACT FEES. IN YOUR LAST STUDY.

INTERSTATE TRAVEL WAS NOT EXCLUDED. AND OUR UNDERSTANDING IS MAYBE AT THE TIME YOU HAD SOME INTERSTATE PROJECTS AND YOU DON'T ANYMORE THAT THE COUNTY IS GOING TO BUILD.

SO WE EXCLUDED THAT SO THAT THAT TRAVEL IS ABOUT 26% OF YOUR TOTAL TRAVEL.

THAT CREATES A DECREASE. AND THEN THE OTHER FACTOR CONTRIBUTING IS YOUR COST PER LANE MILE INCREASE OVER 80%.

[02:05:06]

BUT THE CAPACITY ALSO INCREASED, MEANING THE TYPE OF PROJECTS THAT ARE BUILDING ARE BEING BUILT ARE GENERATING MORE CAPACITY COMPARED TO THOSE IN THE LAST STUDY. SO THAT COST PER CAPACITY DOESN'T INCREASE AS MUCH AS THE COST PER LANE.

MILE IS STILL AN INCREASE, BUT IT'S NOT AS MUCH.

SO BETWEEN THOSE TWO, LIKE THE CALCULATED FEE FOR A MIDSIZE HOME IS HIGHER THAN WHAT WAS CALCULATED IN THE LAST STUDY, BUT THAT ABOUT 10% DECREASE FROM THE CURRENT FEE BECAUSE YOU'VE BEEN INDEXING THE FEE.

SO YOU'RE INDEXING BASICALLY KEPT UP. BUT THERE IS A THERE'S A 10% DIFFERENTIAL.

AND NOW WE ALSO REVIEWED THE BENEFITS ZONES. WE REALLY DON'T HAVE ANY PROPOSED CHANGES YOU HAVE FOR BENEFIT ZONES.

WE REVIEWED THE TRAVEL PATTERNS, DEVELOPMENT PATTERNS LOOKED AT THE AREA SIZE AND SO FORTH.

WE THINK THEY ARE FUNCTIONING WELL. WE ARE NOT SUGGESTING ANY CHANGES THERE.

CONSERVATION AND OPEN SPACE. THAT'S A NEW FEE FOR YOU TO CONSIDER.

AND AGAIN IT'S CALCULATED VERY SIMILARLY TO THE OTHER POPULATION BASED FEES.

LOOKING AT YOUR INVENTORY VALUE AND ANY OTHER SOURCES.

SO THEY ARE BECAUSE IT'S A NEW FEE. IT'S NOT SUBJECT TO ANY KIND OF CAP.

SO THEY RANGE LIKE A MID-SIZE HOME IS ABOUT $620 AND SO ON.

SO THIS SLIDE IS SHOWING AGAIN SUMMARY OF THE FEES.

ALL FEES ADDED TOGETHER. AGAIN FOR SELECT LAND USERS.

SO FOR 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOME, THE CURRENT FEE IS ABOUT 20,001 70, CALCULATED FEE IS ABOUT 21 754 AND THEN THE MAXIMUM FEE IS ABOUT 21 100. SO AGAIN WE ARE HERE TODAY TO GET YOUR INPUT. ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

AND THEN I BELIEVE THE COUNTY WILL MOVE TOWARD THE IMPLEMENTATION PROCESS.

DO WE HAVE QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD? YOU KNOW, I'D REALLY LIKE TO TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT.

AND THEN AND THEN I DO HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS. AND MAYBE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS DO, TOO.

COMMISSIONER MURPHY, WOULD THAT BE ALL RIGHT? YES, MA'AM.

I THINK THAT'S A GREAT IDEA. YEAH. EXCUSE ME.

WE'RE NOW HERE. PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER TWO.

THANK YOU. MY NAME IS DAVID WILLIAMS. I LIVE IN FLAGLER ESTATES, WHICH IS A SPECIAL DISTRICT.

IT'S THE ONLY SPECIAL DISTRICT THAT THE COUNTY HAS.

AND THAT POINT IS IMPORTANT TO ME, AS I'VE BEEN HERE BEFORE, MANY TIMES.

AND I'VE BEEN LOOKING FORWARD TO WHAT THE FUTURE HOLDS, LET'S SAY, WITH REGARDS TO THE INCREASE IN POPULATION AND THE INCREASE IN OUR CONTRIBUTIONS TO IMPACT FEES THAT WE ARE MAKING.

AS YOU MIGHT KNOW, WE HAVE GONE FROM $32 MILLION IN APPRAISED VALUE TO $390 MILLION IN THE LAST YEAR. IT WAS 100 MILLION AS SUCH.

AND OF COURSE, THE MONIES THAT ARE COLLECTED ON THE ON THE CRA SIDE, LET'S SAY SOME OF THAT MONEY GOES INTO OUR TRUST FUND. OKAY. BUT THERE ARE MANY PARTS OF FLAGLER ESTATES THAT RECEIVE NOTHING BECAUSE WE OWN THE ROADS. AND THAT SEEMS TO BE THE BIG PROBLEM, THAT BECAUSE WE ARE A SPECIAL DISTRICT, THE ONLY ONE SO HAPPENS THAT WE RECEIVE NO ROAD IMPACT FEES.

NOW WE HAVE A LOT OF DIRT ROADS OUT THERE, AND WE PUT IN ABOUT TWO MILES OF ROAD A YEAR.

WELL, AT 200 MILES, I'M GOING TO BE LONG GONE BY THE TIME WE GET TO THAT.

AND SO I REALLY BELIEVE THAT IT'S NOT FAIR TO THE FLAGLER ESTATES NOT TO

[02:10:02]

BE A PART OF WHAT IT PRODUCES, TO ACTUALLY COMPLETE THE ROADS THAT WE HAVE.

ALL RIGHT. THE CRA IS HELPING A LITTLE BIT IN SMALL PROJECTS, BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT'S GOING TO DO THAT.

AND AS WE INCREASE I THINK WE WENT UP 200 LAST YEAR.

OKAY. SO YOU HAVE SOME IDEA AND SOME FOLKS BOUGHT A DIRT ROAD DON'T SEEM TO BE A PROBLEM.

BUT THERE'S A LOT OF FOLKS THAT SAY, WELL, WAIT A MINUTE, WHEN'S THE ROAD GETTING PUT IN? WELL, IT'S NOT BECAUSE IT WILL TAKE SO LONG FOR US TO RAISE THAT MONEY.

AND AND WE'RE GETTING A 25 AND A 35% INCREASE IN OUR AD VALOREM TAXES, WHEREAS THE COUNTY TAX IS FLAT. SO I JUST WANT YOU TO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION.

REALLY, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THIS DOCUMENT TO SEE HOW WE CAN GET TREATED BETTER.

THANK YOU SIR. THANK YOU. GOOD MORNING. I'M DAVID UNCAPHER.

I LIVE IN WORLD GOLF VILLAGE. I THINK I'VE WORKED FOR THE US DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, SO I AM VERY AWARE OF, YOU KNOW, THE ESPECIALLY WITH THE NEEDS THAT I SEE AS WE'VE RECENTLY RELOCATED HERE TO SAINT JOHNS COUNTY. I AM NOT CLEAR ON HOW THE IMPACT FEE IS.

PRORATED BETWEEN RESIDENCES AND BUSINESSES. WHERE I LIVE IT'S GETTING YOU KNOW, THE TRAFFIC IS NOT BEEN.

WELL THE PROACTIVE WORK HAS NOT REALLY BEEN DONE THAT I CAN SEE AT I-95 AND INTERNATIONAL GOLF IN THAT AREA.

SO I ALSO WONDER ABOUT THE PARTNERSHIP WITH FDOT AND HOW, YOU KNOW, THAT'S BEING DONE IN ORDER TO BE MORE PROACTIVELY ADDRESSING SOME OF THESE ISSUES. I GUESS I WOULD SAY AT THE BOTTOM LINE, IT DOES SEEM OBVIOUS THAT SOMETHING IS NOT WORKING, BECAUSE WITH THE IMPACT FEES OR WITH THE THE WHOLE REVENUE IN GENERAL.

I DON'T KNOW HOW THIS WORKS WITH PROPERTY TAXES AND THE, THE FUNDS THAT FDOT GETS AND SO FORTH.

BUT I THINK SOME KIND OF SYNCHRONIZATION OF THESE DIFFERENT SOURCES OF TRAFFIC AND OF RESOURCES THAT CAN ADDRESS THE SITUATION AND WHAT APPEARS TO BE ONE OF THE GROWING COUNTIES IN THE FLORIDA, FOR SURE, IF NOT THE UNITED STATES. SO I'M ALSO CURIOUS ABOUT THE TIMING OF THE IMPACT FEES.

LIKE IF YOU COME IN WITH A BUCKY'S AND THEN LATER YOU GOT A COSTCO, AND THEN LATER YOU GOT A BASS PRO SHOP, AND LATER YOU GOT A HOME DEPOT, AND THEN YOU GOT A WALMART.

IF IF THE FEE WAS FIGURED WHEN THERE WASN'T ALL THAT.

I WONDER HOW YOU CAN EQUITABLY CALCULATE THAT FEE.

ONCE YOU SEE WHAT IS BEGINNING TO HAPPEN AND HOW YOU CAN MAYBE POTENTIALLY UPDATE IT FOR WHAT IS WHAT KIND OF TRAFFIC IS TRULY BEING GENERATED.

I'D ALSO LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT THERE BE A CLEAR CONNECTION BETWEEN THE REVENUE AND REAL INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECTS.

THIS IS ALL LOOKING FORWARD WHEN YOU COLLECT THE FEE, AND THEN SOMETIMES IT TAKES QUITE A WHILE TO GET THE PROJECT DONE.

AND SO I THINK THAT IS ALSO AN IMPORTANT TIE THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE.

AND SO I THINK THAT'S I'LL JUST END BY SAYING THAT MY PROPERTY TAXES ARE PLENTY RIGHT NOW.

AND SO I THINK BUSINESSES THAT ARE CREATING MORE OF THIS TRAFFIC, I THINK THAT IMPACT FEE SHOULD BE ADDRESSING THAT MAYBE A LITTLE BIT BETTER. SO THANKS. THANK YOU. NICOLE CROSBY, 1169 NECK ROAD. I'M GOING TO START WITH WHAT I REALLY LOVE ABOUT WHAT I JUST HEARD WAS, WHICH IS THE POSSIBILITY OF CONSERVATION AND OPEN SPACES IMPACT FEES DESPERATELY NEED THAT. I MEAN, I THINK WE ALL KEEP WONDERING WHERE IS OUR MONEY GOING TO COME FROM FOR ACQUISITION OF LAND.

YOU KNOW, WE LOOK AT LAMP 2 MILLION A YEAR. IT'S BASICALLY A DROP IN THE BUCKET IN THIS COUNTY.

WE CAN BUY A LITTLE POSTAGE STAMPS, PIECES OF LAND, BUT NOT A WHOLE LOT.

YOU KNOW, WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT LAMP, I ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT LAMP WAS GOING TO BE SORT OF AN ADJUNCT TO THE COUNTY COMMISSION CONTINUING TO BUY SIGNIFICANT PIECES OF LAND.

THAT DIDN'T. THAT WASN'T THE CASE. WE HAVEN'T REALLY SEEN THAT.

SO WHERE DOES THAT MONEY COME FROM? I MEAN, THAT THIS WOULD BE A TERRIFIC, TREMENDOUS SOURCE ALSO.

YOU KNOW, WE'VE ALWAYS BEEN TOLD THAT WHEN BIG DEVELOPMENTS GO IN THAT THE DEVELOPERS INCLUDE PRESERVE LAND,

[02:15:07]

AND THAT ALWAYS SOUNDED GOOD. BUT THEN I SPOKE TO THE FORMER HEAD OF THE NORTH FLORIDA LAND TRUST RECENTLY, AND HE SAID, GUESS WHAT? THAT SO-CALLED PRESERVE LAND.

THERE ARE NO RESTRICTIONS ON IT. THERE HAVE BEEN CASES OF THAT PRESERVE LAND GETTING DEVELOPED.

SO WE CAN'T COUNT ON DEVELOPERS SO-CALLED PRESERVE LAND STAYING THAT WAY.

SO WE REALLY NEED TO FIND A WAY TO PERMANENTLY ACQUIRE MORE LAND SO WE CAN HAVE A BETTER BALANCE WITH THE DEVELOPMENT OF THIS COUNTY.

SO I'M ALL IN FAVOR OF THAT, AND I REALLY HOPE THAT YOU ALL WILL CONTINUE, WILL CONSIDER ADOPTING THAT INTO WHATEVER YOU DECIDE ON ABOUT IMPACT FEES.

I WOULD LOVE TO SEE I THINK THAT THE IMPACT FEES, FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, WHAT WE'VE BEEN SHOWN SO FAR, MAYBE ON THE LOW SIDE, LET'S NOT FORGET THAT THAT FIVE YEARS AGO IMPACT FEES WERE LOWERED FOR CERTAIN SIZES OF HOMES.

I THINK EVEN THE 2000 SQUARE FOOT HOMES. SO, I MEAN, WE SHOULD ACTUALLY BE MAKING UP FOR THAT DECISION OF FIVE YEARS AGO.

AND THEN ON TOP OF THAT, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE ALL THIS, YOU KNOW, ADDITIONAL DEVELOPMENT THAT'S OCCURRED.

AND I KNOW WE CAN'T DO IMPACT FEES FOR PAST DEVELOPMENT.

BUT I'M LOOKING AT AN ARTICLE HERE, ONE OF A LOT OF ARTICLES THAT'S OUT THERE RIGHT NOW ABOUT ALL THESE STUDIES ALL AROUND THE STATE.

I MEAN, ALL THESE COUNTIES ALL AROUND THE STATE THAT ARE INCREASING IMPACT FEES. I'LL JUST READ POLK COUNTY.

I THINK THEY MIGHT BE THE FASTEST GROWING RIGHT NOW.

POLK IMPACT FEES COULD SKYROCKET PAST STATE LAW MAXIMUMS BECAUSE OF EXTRAORDINARY GROWTH.

HAVEN'T WE SEEN EXTRAORDINARY GROWTH HERE? SO I'M ASKING YOU ALL TO REALLY LOOK AT THOSE IMPACT FEES AND HOW MUCH THEY'RE GOING TO INCREASE AND HOW MUCH THEY CAN INCREASE.

AND CONSIDER WHAT MAY BE EXTRAORDINARY. OKAY.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

GOOD MORNING. MY NAME IS SUSAN JENNESS AND I LIVE IN NORTH BEACH.

I'M A REPRESENTATIVE OF CARE, AND I'M GOING TO READ TALKING POINTS THAT VICKI PEPPER WROTE AFTER READING ABOUT THE IMPACT FEES.

WE ARE STILL ATTEMPTING TO DIGEST THE NEARLY 200 PAGES OF THE IMPACT FEE UPDATE STUDY AND MAY HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT IT IN THE FUTURE.

THE SLIDES APPEAR TO BE SUGGESTING THAT THE STUDY SHOWED THE PROJECTED TRANSPORTATION IMPACT OF RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT IS REDUCED FROM CURRENT LEVELS.

THIS IS COUNTERINTUITIVE. SO IF OUR INTERPRETATION OF THE SLIDES IS CORRECT, THEN WE QUESTION THIS FINDING.

AND I KNOW THAT THAT WAS ADDRESSED. OUR BIGGEST CONCERN ABOUT IMPACT FEES IS THAT THEY POSE A SIGNIFICANT IMPEDIMENT TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY. ESPECIALLY HOUSING ATTAINABLE BY THOSE AT LOWER INCOME LEVELS, SUCH AS 60, 50, AND 30% OF OUR AREA MEDIAN INCOME. CARE HAS LONG ADVOCATED THAT THE COUNTY EITHER WAIVE THE IMPACT FEES FOR DEVELOPERS WHO WORK IN THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING SPACE, OR OTHERWISE CONTRIBUTE FUNDING THAT WILL DEFRAY THE COST TO SUCH DEVELOPERS.

WE ALSO NOTE THAT IN ITS 2024 ANNUAL REPORT, THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING ADVISORY COMMITTEE RECOMMENDED SEVERAL CHANGES TO SAINT JOHNS COUNTY IMPACT FEE POLICY THAT WOULD PROMOTE THE DEVELOPMENT OF MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

PLEASE IMPLEMENT THESE RECOMMENDATIONS. WE HAVE ALWAYS ADVOCATED FOR SMART GROWTH RATHER THAN NO GROWTH POLICY FOR SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, AND GIVEN THE NEED TO BUILD OUR HOUSING STOCK AVAILABLE TO THOSE AT INCOME LEVELS BELOW 80% AMI.

WE BELIEVE THAT MUCH OF OUR DEVELOPMENT OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS NEEDS TO BE AFFORDABLE.

WHATEVER YOU DECIDE TO DO, WE URGE YOU NOT TO MAKE ANY CHANGES TO THE SAINT JOHNS COUNTY IMPACT FEE POLICY THAT WILL MAKE IT HARDER, RATHER THAN EASIER, FOR DEVELOPERS WORKING IN THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING SPACE TO MAKE THEIR HOUSING AFFORDABLE.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. CHUCK LABANOWSKI, 1748 NORTH CAPRERA.

I WOULD LOVE TO SEE AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S POSSIBLE OR NOT.

WITH THE STATE LAWS AND SO FORTH. HOW ABOUT A COST OF LIVING? INCREASE ON THE IMPACT FEES TODAY. WHAT'S IT COST PER MILE TO BUILD A ROAD? IT'S A WHOLE LOT MORE THAN IT WAS TEN YEARS AGO.

IT'S PROBABLY WHAT QUADRUPLED AT LEAST. AND THE OTHER THING I'D LOVE TO SEE, WE ALLOWED DEVELOPERS TO GO OUT AND PHASE IN THEIR IMPACT FEES. AND IF I UNDERSTAND IT CORRECTLY, AND I'LL USE WORLD GOLF AS AN EXAMPLE.

WORLD GOLF VILLAGE COMMERCE CENTER DOESN'T HAVE TO PAY IMPACT FEES.

PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG UNTIL THEY GET COMPLETE WITH PHASE THREE.

THEY'VE ALREADY IMPACTED THE AREA TREMENDOUSLY.

WE HAVE TO CHANGE THAT. INSTEAD OF HAVING TO PHASE IN, LET'S CUT THAT PHASE IN TIME IN HALF FOR THESE LARGE DEVELOPMENTS,

[02:20:06]

BECAUSE BY THE TIME THEY GET THROUGH DEVELOPING AND I THINK WORLD COMMERCE WAS BACK IN 2003, 2004, WHAT'S IT COST NOW FOR THE ROADS? OKAY.

WE NEED TO NEED TO DO SOMETHING UPFRONT AND NOT IN THE PAST.

LET'S BE PROACTIVE, NOT REACTIVE. NOW, THE OTHER THING I'D LOVE TO SEE, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S POSSIBLE.

WHY ARE WE GIVING THE DEVELOPMENTS 100% OF THEIR TRANSPORTATION IMPACT WHEN THEY BUILD A ROAD? WHY CAN'T WE WORK OUT A PERCENTAGE? THAT ROAD IS THERE TO BENEFIT THEM AS WELL AS THE COMMUNITY.

SO WHY DO WE HAVE TO PAY THEM 100%? WHY NOT, YOU KNOW, SHARE THE COST OF THE ROAD? THAT'S A GOOD DEVELOPMENT. SHOULD PAY UPFRONT OR PORTION OF THAT ROAD BECAUSE IT BENEFITS THEM.

WITHOUT THAT ROAD, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE A COMMUNITY.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. CAN I CAN I ASK A QUESTION? MADAM CHAIR, I WANT TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC COMMENT.

ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM TWO? SEEING. ONE LESS STRAGGLER. MR. ROBERSON KIND OF PUT A MONKEY WRENCH INTO.

I WAS READY TO STAND UP. SUZANNE CLULOW 109, LAUREL WOOD WAY 32086.

MISS SPIEGEL SAID TO TELL YOU THAT SHE THINKS IT WAS A GOOD PRESENTATION, SO SHE DOESN'T HAVE TO TAKE THREE MORE MINUTES TO TELL YOU THAT.

SO I DID. IT WAS A GOOD PRESENTATION. THERE WAS A LOT OF INFORMATION THERE.

I KNOW WHEN I WENT TO DIG IN DEEPER BEFORE BEING HERE TODAY AND SAW THAT THE DOCUMENT WAS LIKE 200 AND SOME PAGES LONG, I REALLY WAS GLAD THEY PUT THE SLIDE PRESENTATION AT THE END, WHICH I COULD GO THROUGH.

AND THAT 200 AND SOMETHING WAS TOO MUCH FOR ME TO BITE OFF.

I THINK IT'S A LOT. WE ALL NEED TO DIGEST WHAT THEY'VE SAID.

I'M 100% IN FAVOR OF THE PROPOSED CONSERVATION IMPACT FEES.

I WILL SAY THAT LAMP IS NOT GIVING US ENOUGH MONEY AND THAT FUND FOR WHAT WE REALLY NEED TO DO.

IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT WE DO HAVE. I BELIEVE I MAY BE QUOTING THIS WRONG.

ABOUT 30% OF THE LAND IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY DOES HAVE CONSERVATION STATUS.

NOW, WHETHER THAT IS IN WRITING CEMENT. BULLETPROOF, I DON'T KNOW.

I DON'T KNOW THAT. BUT WE DO HAVE A LOT OF LARGE PIECES SET ASIDE.

AND I KNOW THAT COMMISSIONER DEAN, FORMER COMMISSIONER DEAN ALWAYS SAID THAT HE LIKED THE LARGE PARCELS RATHER THAN EACH LITTLE DEVELOPMENT.

GIVES YOU A HALF ACRE PLAYGROUND AND SAYS IT'S, YOU KNOW, CONSERVATION.

SO I THINK THAT WOULD BE A BIG HELP. THE AHAC MEETING THAT I REFERENCED EARLIER, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS IMPACT FEE POSSIBLY GETTING IT WAIVED. I HAVEN'T LOOKED INTO IT THAT CLOSELY.

I THINK FOR SOME OF THE SMALLER BILL BUILDERS AND THE SMALLER PROJECTS LIKE THE PATRIOT PLACE AND SOME OTHERS IT WOULD BE VERY, VERY HELPFUL FOR BUILDERS OF DRIS AND PUDS WHO THEY DON'T CARE BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE IT UP ON THE OTHER 70% OF THE BUILDS THAT THEY DO.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S EVEN LEGAL TO CHARGE ONE ENTITY THIS AND ANOTHER ONE THAT, BUT IT'S SOMETHING I THINK WE NEED TO THINK ABOUT.

OUT. LET'S SEE WHAT ELSE. I FOUND THE FLAGLER ESTATES CONVERSATION VERY INTERESTING. I DON'T HAVE TO DO SOME DIGGING INTO THAT ONE, BUT I THINK IT'S WORTH TALKING ABOUT SOME MORE.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT FOR AGENDA ITEM NUMBER TWO? SEEING NONE, WE'LL CLOSE. PUBLIC COMMENT. ALL RIGHT. WE'RE BACK TO THE BOARD, COMMISSIONER MURPHY. NO, MIKE, THIS QUESTION MIGHT BE FOR YOU. THERE IS A PERCENTAGE OF CREDIT OR USER CREDIT FOR IMPACT FEES FOR DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT? I THINK CHUCK SAID THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE A PERCENTAGE.

RIGHT, RIGHT. THEY DON'T WE DON'T. WE HAVE ONE FOR IMPACT FEE TAX CREDITS WHEN IT COMES TO THAT, BASED ON WHAT THEIR PERSONAL USE WOULD BE IN THEIR OWN DEVELOPMENT?

[02:25:01]

SURE. THROUGH THE CHAIR. WE DO CALCULATE THEIR USE AND DEDUCT THAT FROM FROM THEM IN THE CALCULATIONS.

YOU'LL NOTICE MAYBE THE STAFF REPORTS WILL HAVE THAT LITTLE PARAGRAPH IN THERE.

THANKS. YES. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? BECAUSE I HAVE SOME WHEN YOU'RE DONE.

YEAH. I JUST WANTED TO TAKE A LOOK AT PAGE 37 AGAIN.

THAT WAS MADAM, MADAM CHAIR, I JUST DID HAVE ONE MORE INFORMATION FOR THE BOARD TO REMIND.

I BRIEFED YOU ALL INDIVIDUALLY ABOUT THE BUY DOWN.

I JUST WANTED TO REMIND YOU THAT'LL BE SOMETHING ELSE WE'LL BE LOOKING IN DIRECTION FOR. AGAIN, THAT'S A SUBSIDIZATION OF THE NON RESIDENTIAL IMPACT FEES SINCE 2018 TO CURRENT BY 40%.

AGAIN COMING OUT OF THE GENERAL FUND. SO THAT THAT WOULD BE ON THE TABLE HERE FOR YOU TO CONSIDER AS WELL.

SO THANK YOU COMMISSIONER TAYLOR. YEAH I JUST WANTED TO TAKE A LOOK AT IT WAS NUMBER SLIDE 37 AGAIN.

THIS ONE. OR IS IT? YEAH. WAS IT 40? NO, IT WAS 37.

BUT JUST ABOUT HOW IT WASN'T GO BACK TO 37. HOW IT'S NOT A DEVELOPER CREDIT FOR CONSTRUCTION.

CAN YOU. I THOUGHT THERE WAS SOMETHING MORE ABOUT THE NON RESIDENTIAL TRANSPORTATION.

WASN'T THAT ON A SLIDE? I MEAN WE SHOWED THE RATES FOR RESIDENTIAL AND NONRESIDENTIAL. IS THAT.

OKAY. SO THAT'S EVERYTHING INCLUDED. THERE'S NOTHING SPECIFIC TO TRANSPORTATION.

CORRECT. THIS THIS THIS SLIDE IS JUST THE TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEES.

AND THEN AT THE VERY END, WE HAD EVERYTHING INCLUDED.

THE SUMMARY SUMMARY SLIDE THAT WAS ADDING ALL THE FEES TOGETHER.

OKAY. SO WITH WHAT WAS JUST SHARED I JUST WANT TO CONFIRM, YOU KNOW, JUST CONFIRM THAT THAT THERE IS A CREDIT TOWARDS A LOT OF THINGS THAT WE'RE PAYING. I JUST WANT CLARIFICATION. RIGHT. IN THIS CASE, THESE FEES THAT WE ARE SHOWING ON THE CURRENT IMPACT FEE IS BEFORE THE CREDIT CURRENTLY.

SO THEY WERE BEING BOUGHT DOWN ANOTHER 40% FROM THOSE NUMBERS.

SO THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. THIS IS TO ME THIS IS A LITTLE BIT MISLEADING RIGHT.

BECAUSE THESE AREN'T THE ACTUAL ACTUAL. THESE ARE NOT THE NUMBERS THAT THEY'RE PAYING.

CORRECT. SO I WOULD LOVE DO YOU HAVE A SLIDE WITH REAL NUMBERS? I DON'T. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE ACTUAL NUMBERS. YEAH WE CAN PROVIDE THAT.

OKAY. BUT THAT WOULD THAT WOULD BE GREAT. I'D LOVE TO SEE, YOU KNOW, REAL STUFF.

THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? SO I'M A KIND OF A DATA PERSON.

AND WHAT WITH YOUR NUMBERS THAT YOU USED FOR THE MYTHOLOGY, MYTHOLOGY, MYTHOLOGY.

OKAY, I SAY IT WRONG, BUT WHAT? WHAT'S THE DATE OF THAT DATA? SO FOR THE CONSTRUCTION COSTS, WE ARE USING PROJECTS.

LOCAL PROJECTS ARE 23, 24. OTHER COUNTIES PROJECTS IS 2020.

AND ON CREDIT DATA. LOOKS BACK FIVE YEARS AND LOOKS FORWARD FIVE YEARS.

WE ARE JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND ON AVERAGE, HOW MUCH COUNTY IS ALLOCATING OTHER REVENUE SOURCES AND LOOKING AT ANNUAL DATA.

DEMAND DATA HAS THREE COMPONENTS TRIP GENERATION FOR MOST STUDIES.

FOR MOST LAND USES, THAT COMES FROM THE INSTITUTE OF TRANSPORTATION ENGINEERS HANDBOOK, AND THAT HAS STUDIES FROM 1980S ON.

WE SUPPLEMENT THAT WITH FLORIDA STUDIES DATABASE THAT HAS STUDIES LIKE ACTUAL STUDIES AT ESTABLISHMENTS THAT MEASURES TRIP GENERATION, TRIP LENGTH, AND PERCENT NEW TRIP.

AND THOSE ARE FROM 90S TO 2010 RANGE. ANY ANY MODELING DATA IS BASED ON YOUR MOST RECENT LONG RANGE TRANSPORTATION PLAN. THAT'S THE 2045, I BELIEVE.

I JUST, YOU KNOW, I LOOKED AT THE NUMBER THAT THEY GAVE ME, BUT IT'S NOT THE NUMBER THAT WAS ON YOUR SLIDES, BUT OUR, OUR STAFF OR OUR TEAM GAVE US THESE NUMBERS AND THEY SHOULD ALL BE GOING UP AND THEY'RE NOT ALL GOING UP.

AND WE'RE ACTUALLY PUTTING IN CONSERVATION LAND TOO.

SO IT SHOULD EVEN BE GOING UP MORE BASED ON TRANSPORTATION NEEDS OF THE FUTURE.

OUR INFRASTRUCTURE IS COLLAPSING. WE CANNOT GO FORWARD FORWARD WITHOUT GETTING THAT IMPACT FEE.

SO WHEN I ASKED YOU BEFORE, WHEN WE WERE TALKING ONLINE AND YOU'RE OUT OF TAMPA AND YOU TOLD ME THAT.

HOW DO YOU WITH THE TRAVEL, TRANSPORTATION? YOU DON'T FIGURE IN HOW FAR PEOPLE TRAVEL.

[02:30:03]

YOU COULD DO THE ROADWAYS. BUT HOW FAR? THAT IS NOT INCLUDED IN THERE.

AND WE ARE A SPREAD OUT COMMUNITY. I DROVE FROM PONTE VEDRA TO THIS OFFICE ALL THE TIME.

IT'S AN HOUR, YOU KNOW, AN HOUR. I'M TRAVELING.

BUT IF YOU JUST DID IT ON ONE LANE ON THE ROAD, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T KNOW MY IMPACT OR MY FAMILY'S IMPACT.

SO I'M CONCERNED THAT THESE ARE LOW. AND I'M CONCERNED THAT WHEN YOU TOLD ME THAT YOU'RE USING 2021 DATA FOR FOR HOW FAR PEOPLE ARE GOING, AND YOU TOLD ME THAT IT'S PEOPLE WHO STAND IN FRONT OF WALMART OR THE CIRCLE K OR DAILIES, AND THEY ASK PEOPLE, WELL, WHERE DO YOU COME FROM? AND THEN YOU RECORD IT. AND THAT WAS FROM 2021, WHICH WAS COVID. SO PEOPLE WEREN'T DRIVING VERY FAR.

IT'S ACTUALLY OLDER THAN THAT. NO, IT'S JUST CONCERNING TO ME.

NO I COMPLETELY I UNDERSTAND COMPLETELY THAT'S A VALID CONCERN.

SO WE WE ARE USING THE BEST AVAILABLE DATA. BUT YOU ARE IF IF THAT'S A TRUE CONCERN, YOU COULD DO ACTUAL STUDIES TODAY AND MEASURE WHAT IT IS IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

WE RAN INTO THAT IN POLK COUNTY THAT WAS MENTIONED.

THEY HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT WAREHOUSES. THEY FELT LIKE INDUSTRY DATA AVAILABLE.

DATA WASN'T REFLECTING THEIR COMMUNITY, AND THEY JUST WENT AND STUDIED SITES AND COUNTED THE TRIPS AND SO ON.

AND IT DID COME OUT HIGHER THAN WHAT WAS THE INDUSTRY.

SO YOU YOU HAVE THE IT JUST WE HAVE TO BASE THE NUMBERS TO SOME DATA AND IT'S NOT PERFECT.

IT ANYBODY SAYS, I MEAN IT'S NOT PERFECT, BUT IT'S THE ONLY ONE THAT HAS THIS MUCH LEVEL OF DATA.

AND THEN THIS OTHER STUDY SUPPLEMENTED IS WHAT'S AVAILABLE THAT WE KNOW OF.

SO AS LONG AS THERE'S A BASIS I MEAN, THAT REFLECTS THE COMMUNITY BETTER, THAT CAN ACTUALLY BE LOOKED INTO.

WELL, I MEAN, I DO HAVE FOUR OTHER OTHER COUNTIES THAT HAVE INFORMATION, AND THEY USED A GROUP CALLED STANTEC, AND THEIR DATA IS APRIL 2024, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, MORE ACCURATE, LIKE THE GENTLEMAN SAID IN THE AUDIENCE, YOU KNOW, WE NOW HAVE BUC-EE'S, WE NOW HAVE FREEWAY TRAFFIC GOING INTO OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.

AND YOU'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE NOT COUNTING FREEWAY TRAFFIC.

I'M JUST REALLY CONCERNED THAT THIS IS NOT ACCURATE AND YOU CAN'T LOWER.

LET'S SEE. WE CAN'T RAISE IMPACT FEES FOR THE NEXT FOUR YEARS, BUT WE CAN LOWER THEM.

SO GOING FORWARD, I THINK OUR IMPACT FEES NEED TO BE, YOU KNOW, GREATER.

AND IN REGARDS TO THE AFFORDABLE PART, BECAUSE IT DOES RAISE THE HOUSE COST BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY THE DEVELOPERS ARE GOING TO PASS IT ON.

MAYBE WE FIGURE OUT SOMETHING FOR THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING. BUT YOU KNOW, THIS IS NOT FAIR TO OUR YOU KNOW, LET ME JUST READ LET ME READ ONE COMMENT. THIS IS FROM A COMMISSIONER IN MANATEE COUNTY.

HE SAID, I TELL YOU WHAT BEARDEN SAID AT THE COUNTY COMMISSION MEETING, HOW MUCH TIME I'VE BEEN STOLEN FROM ME, GETTING IN MY CAR AND DRIVING AN HOUR AND A HALF, DRIVING FROM POINT A TO POINT B, THAT'S A DADGUM CURSE.

I CAN'T BUY ANY MORE TIME BACK ON THIS EARTH.

AND YET I GET IT STOLEN EVERY DAY, DAY AFTER DAY.

AND SO NOW IT'S TIME TO REVERSE THE CURSE. AND I HOPE I GET THE SUPPORT OF THE BOARD.

I MEAN, THESE KIND OF THIS IS NOT JUST HERE, IT'S IN OUR COUNTY.

AND WE'RE THE WE WERE THE FASTEST GROWING COUNTY IN 2022.

I'M CONCERNED THAT THESE NUMBERS ARE NOT CORRECT, AND I DON'T KNOW, BUT I'D LOVE A SECOND OPINION.

AND I DON'T KNOW HOW WE GO ABOUT DOING THAT. I JUST WANTED TO KNOW WHAT THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS THOUGHT ABOUT THAT.

I DO HAVE A QUESTION. I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW. HOW MUCH HAVE WE SPENT ON THIS STUDY? CAN SOMEBODY ANSWER THAT? HOW MUCH IS OUR COUNTY SPENT TO GET THIS INFORMATION? GOOD MORNING, COMMISSIONERS WADE SCHROEDER WITH THE OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET. I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT EXPENSE AMOUNTS THAT WHAT WE SPENT TO DATE ON IT, BUT I CAN GIVE YOU INFORMATION FROM WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY CONTRACTED FOR THIS PROJECT.

AND THERE'S MULTIPLE COMPONENTS TO THE PROJECT BEYOND IMPACT FEES.

THERE'S A REVIEW OF MOBILITY FEE OR MOBILITY PLAN, AS WELL AS CONCURRENCY AND PROP SHARE.

SO IT'S NOT ALL JUST IMPACT FEES. ALL OF THOSE COMPONENTS COMBINED WAS ORIGINALLY ABOUT 420,000.

THE IMPACT FEE COMPONENT OF IT WAS 175,000. AND THERE WERE A COUPLE CHANGE ORDERS ALONG THE WAY, ONE FOR TO REVIEW THE CONSERVATION IMPACT FEE OR TO PROPOSE THAT AS WELL AS THE REVIEW OF THE BENEFIT DISTRICT.

SO THAT ADDED ABOUT ANOTHER 30 PLUS THOUSAND.

SO A LITTLE OVER 200,000 RELATED JUST TO THE IMPACT FEE COMPONENT OF THE OVERALL PROJECT.

GREAT, GREAT. THANK YOU. NO, I APPRECIATE THAT BECAUSE THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY TO SPEND ON INFORMATION THAT ISN'T ACCURATE AND RECENT.

THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY FOR OUR COUNTY TO SPEND.

SO THAT'S THAT'S YEAH. I DON'T FEEL REAL GOOD ABOUT THAT.

ALSO, I REALLY APPRECIATE WITH WHAT MR. HUNGERFORD SAID EARLIER, SOMETHING IS NOT WORKING IN OUR COUNTY.

[02:35:07]

SOMETHING IS NOT WORKING. AND REGARDING I MEAN, WE IF WE ARE IF WE ARE NOT AN EXAMPLE OF AN EXTRAORDINARY SITUATION IN OUR COUNTY REGARDING OUR ROADS AND THAT I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS.

AND WE, WE I MEAN, WE SHOULD BE EXTRAORDINARY.

SAINT JOHNS COUNTY. I MEAN, BY FAR WE ARE. SO, YOU KNOW, I JUST WANTED TO SHARE THAT WE'RE WE'VE GOT A SERIOUS ISSUE HERE.

YES. AND THAT'S TRANSPORTATION. WHEN WE LOOK AT A COMMUNITY, TRANSPORTATION AND SCHOOLS MAKE UP ABOUT 70 TO 85% OF INFRASTRUCTURE VALUE.

SO THEY ARE THE MOST EXPENSIVE INFRASTRUCTURE AND THE FEES REFLECT THAT.

AND YOUR FEE IS ON THE HIGH END OF WHEN WE LOOK AT STATEWIDE.

BUT AGAIN, THE NEEDS ARE ACCUMULATION OF, YOU KNOW, NOT BEING ABLE TO INVEST OVER THE YEARS.

YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE A FUEL TAX THAT'S VERY INEFFICIENT REVENUE SOURCE BECAUSE IT'S PER GALLON BASIS AND THE LOCAL PENNIES ARE NOT ALLOWED TO BE INDEXED.

SO WHEN WE LOOK AT IT, A PENNY IN MID 90S IS WORTH HALF ITS VALUE.

SO YOU HAVE A DEDICATED SOURCE BUT IT'S NOT EFFICIENT EITHER.

SO RIGHT NOW IN MOST COUNTIES THAT'S ONLY ENOUGH TO COVER MAYBE MAINTENANCE.

SO THEN THAT'S WHY YOU ARE ENDING UP HAVING TO USE SALES TAX, GENERAL TAX AND SO ON.

IMPACT FEES CANNOT CHARGE FOR SOMETHING THAT'S NOT ACHIEVED.

SO IF YOU HAVE A CERTAIN LEVEL OF SERVICE, SOME LEVEL OF CONGESTION, WE CAN'T CHARGE THEM AT A RATE TO FIX THAT.

AT BEST THEY CAN DO IS MAINTAIN THAT AND THEN ALLOW THE ALLOW THE TAXES TO IMPROVE THE LEVEL OF SERVICE.

ONCE IT'S IMPROVED, THEN THEY GET CHARGED FOR IT.

I THE DATA IN THIS STUDY IS THE MOST RECENT AND MOST ACCURATE.

WE'VE DONE STUDIES. I DON'T KNOW, OVER 30 YEARS, MAYBE 500 STUDIES.

WE'VE NEVER BEEN CHALLENGED. SO I REALLY HAVE I MEAN IT'S VERY TRANSPARENT REPORT.

YOU CAN READ IT HOW WE GOT EVERY NUMBERS. AND IF THERE IS A BETTER DATA SOURCE WE ARE MORE THAN WILLING TO COMPARE IT.

BUT AND USE IT. BUT IT JUST NEEDS TO BE SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DEFEND AT COURT IF CHALLENGED.

SO SO TRANSPORTATION IS VERY COMPLEX. I MEAN, EVERYTHING IS VERY, VERY EXPENSIVE.

NOT ONE REVENUE SOURCE IS GOING TO SOLVE EVERYTHING.

DEFINITELY NOT IMPACT FEES. EVEN AT THE COUNTIES WHO ALWAYS KEPT UP AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL.

IT MAY BE THEY COVER 40% OF THE COST AT BEST.

SO IT JUST IT'S JUST ONE OF THE TOOLS. COMMISSIONER MURPHY.

I GUESS THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS IS TO GET DIRECTION TO STAFF.

SO WHY DON'T WE SEE IF WE CAN'T GIVE STAFF SOME DIRECTION? I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE CONTINUE TO LOOK AT THIS.

THE ISSUE OF IMPACT FEES. I THINK WE'RE LEAVING SOME ON THE TABLE.

WE HAD TALKED ABOUT NONRESIDENTIAL CONCURRENCY ISSUES.

SO WE'VE GOT WE'VE STILL GOT WORK TO DO. THE QUESTION IS YOU GUYS NEED DIRECTION, AND THAT'S PROBABLY WHAT WE NEED TO FOCUS ON NOW IS GIVING YOU GUYS SOMETHING TO SOMETHING TO DO. MADAM CHAIR, I'VE GOT COMMISSIONER.

QUESTIONS AND THOUGHTS. TO THE GENTLEMAN WHO LIVES IN WORLD GOLF VILLAGE AND USED TO WORK FOR FDOT.

I JUST WANT TO BRING TO YOUR ATTENTION THE FACT THAT WE DO HAVE OVER $1 BILLION OF TRANSPORTATION INFRASTRUCTURE FUNDED.

IT'S JUST A MATTER OF GETTING IT BUILT. AND YOU ALLUDED TO THAT. YOU MAY HAVE EVEN DIRECTLY MENTIONED THAT WE HAVE A TEN LANING OF I-95.

THAT PROJECT HAS BEEN FUNDED BY THE FDOT. CAN'T HAPPEN SOON ENOUGH.

WE'RE ALL WAITING WITH BATED BREATH. WE HAVE THE FIRST COAST EXPRESSWAY, WHICH WILL FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGE THE WAY THE TRAFFIC FLOWS HERE IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

WE'RE BUILDING 2209. AND SINCE I'VE BEEN ON THE BOARD, WE'VE APPROVED THREE PROJECTS THAT HAVE REQUIRED THE DEVELOPER TO BUILD THE ROADS BEFORE THE FIRST HOUSE WAS OCCUPIED BY RESIDENTS. SO THAT IS A SHIFT FROM THE WAY THAT THINGS WERE APPROVED IN THE PAST.

THE COMMERCIAL NODE THAT YOU'RE ALLUDING TO OR THAT YOU'VE MENTIONED? BUCKIES.

THAT WAS ALL APPROVED IN THE EARLY 2000 AND IN THE LATE 90S.

AND SO OBVIOUSLY WE CAN'T UNRING THAT BELL. WE CAN'T PUT THE TOOTHPASTE BACK IN THE TUBE OR WHATEVER OTHER ANALOGY YOU WANT TO MAKE.

WE CANNOT UNDO THAT SITUATION. BUT WE ARE WORKING VERY HARD WITH FDOT TO TO MAKE THE SITUATION BETTER POST DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENTS.

SO I WANTED TO MAKE YOU AWARE OF THAT. IN 2023, WE HAD A TRANSPORTATION FORUM FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THIS COUNTY'S HISTORY WE HAD FEDERAL, STATE AND LOCAL ELECTED OFFICIALS WHO SAT UP HERE ON THIS DAIS ALONG WITH FDOT, TO DISCUSS ONE ISSUE, AND THAT WAS TRANSPORTATION. SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE YOU TO GO BACK TO GTV AND WATCH THAT MEETING, BECAUSE IT WAS DISCUSSED IN DETAIL, AND WE SPENT HOURS ON THIS DAIS DISCUSSING TRANSPORTATION INFRASTRUCTURE.

SO JUST SO YOU ALL KNOW, $1 BILLION HAS BEEN FUNDED.

[02:40:01]

AGAIN, WE'RE JUST TRYING TO GET IT BUILT. SO THAT'S THAT.

I AM VERY EXCITED JUST IN TERMS OF DIRECTION TO THE STAFF.

I'M VERY EXCITED ABOUT THE CONSERVATION IMPACT FEE.

IF WE CAN CONTINUE THE EFFORT THAT WE STARTED WITH LAMP AND BUY UP MORE PIECES OF OF IMPORTANT LAND GREEN SPACE HERE IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY WOULD SUPPORT THAT. I THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT SOME SORT OF REDUCTION OR BUYBACK OF IMPACT FEES FOR HOUSING DEVELOPMENTS THAT BUILD TRULY AFFORDABLE HOUSING, NOT THE 80 TO 120% OF AMI, BUT IF IT'S 60% OF AMI OR LESS, I KNOW CLAY COUNTY HAS AN IMPACT FEE ORDINANCE THAT'S IN PLACE THAT'S WORKING. CLAY COUNTY IS A VERY CONSERVATIVE COUNTY, BUT YET WE HAVE TO HOUSE OUR WORKFORCE.

AND I THINK THAT WE SHOULD LOOK AT WHATEVER THIS BOARD DEEMS IS IS THE RIGHT AMOUNT OF ARMY.

IF THEY CAN MEET THAT, THEN GOVERNMENT SHOULD NOT BE STANDING IN THE WAY OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

AND THAT'S WHAT AN IMPACT FEE IS. IT'S JUST IT'S A GOVERNMENT FEE.

I DON'T THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE CONSIDERING AT ALL THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCE.

I WANT TO GO DOWN THE LIST OF SOME OF THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCE COSTS RIGHT NOW TO OPEN UP A HEALTH AND FITNESS CLUB.

YOU'D BE PAYING $12,796 PER 1000FT². IF WE ENACT THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCE, YOU'D BE PAYING $35,201 PER 1000FT² IN IMPACT FEES TO THE COUNTY.

THE FREESTANDING EMERGENCY ROOM WOULD GO UP FROM $4 PER 1000FT² TO $25,193 PER 1000FT². MEDICAL OFFICE. $16,000 TO $37,000. AND THE FAST FOOD RESTAURANT WITH THE DRIVE THRU.

CHICK FIL A. THE LORD'S CHICKEN WOULD GO UP FROM $25,000 PER 1000FT² TO $122,000 PER 1000FT². IT'S UNCONSCIONABLE THAT AT A TIME WHERE WE'VE BEEN LIVING WITH INCREASED INFLATION, THAT A BOARD OF CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICANS WOULD ENACT A GOVERNMENT FEE.

HOW ARE WE GOING TO LOOK AT OUR NEIGHBORS AND OUR FRIENDS AND THE ESSENTIAL WORKFORCE IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY AND SAY, I'M SORRY. THE FAST FOOD THAT YOU HAVE TO GO GET ON YOUR LUNCH BREAK, THE BIG MAC IS GOING TO COST YOU MORE.

THE CHICKEN SANDWICH IS GOING TO COST YOU MORE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO PUNISH DEVELOPMENT.

THIS NEVER PUNISHES DEVELOPMENT. IT PUNISHES OUR RESIDENTS IMPACT FEES HAVE STOOD IN THE WAY OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR MANY YEARS.

WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO ABOUT IT? OR WE SHOULD JUST SAY INTO THE MICROPHONE, WE DON'T CARE ABOUT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, BUT WE CANNOT AFFORD TO ENACT THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCE BECAUSE WE HAVE A WE HAVE THE INFLATIONARY FACTORS IN THIS COUNTRY ARE A LOT OF TIMES OUTSIDE OF OUR CONTROL, BUT WE CAN'T GENUINELY TALK ABOUT HOW WE CARE ABOUT THE COST OF MEDICINE AND MEDICAL CARE IN THE COUNTRY, AND THEN ENACT A THREE TIMES INCREASE ON MEDICAL OFFICE AND ON FREESTANDING EMERGENCY ROOMS. SO I WILL NOT SUPPORT THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCE. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT IS CLEAR DIRECTION OR NOT, BUT BUT IN TERMS OF THE CONSERVATION IMPACT FEES AND FOR THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING YOU KNOW, I THINK WE NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT BOTH OF THOSE, BUT BUT THE STATUTORY MAXIMUM SEEMS LIKE ENOUGH.

I DO NOT HAVE THE SAME SKEPTICISM ABOUT YOUR PROCESS.

YOU'VE DONE OVER 500 OF THESE. AS YOU SAID, WE CAN SPEND A LOT MORE MONEY TO DO ANOTHER STUDY AND USE DIFFERENT METHODOLOGY, BUT I TRUST YOUR BACKGROUND AND THE PROFESSIONALISM THAT YOU BROUGHT TO THIS STUDY.

I TRUST THE NUMBERS. THE NUMBERS ARE GOOD. THANK YOU, MR. ARNOLD. YES, THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. THANK YOU AGAIN FOR THAT PRESENTATION. I KNOW THAT WAS A LOT OF INFORMATION. I MY QUESTION WOULD BE I DON'T QUESTION YOUR METHODOLOGY EITHER.

YOU GUYS ARE CLEARLY WELL RESPECTED IN YOUR FIELD.

IS IT POSSIBLE, THOUGH, NOT GETTING A SECOND OPINION? BUT IT WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE FOR US TO CONSIDER A DIFFERENT DATA SET, MAYBE TO ASSUAGE SOME OF THESE FEARS THAT THAT WE'RE NOT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE MOST RECENT DATA OR THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE DATA? I MEAN, WE CAN LOOK AT SOME MORE. WE CAN LOOK AT, AGAIN, TO CENSUS DATA TO SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING MORE RECENT CAME OUT SINCE YOUR STUDY STARTED, SOME OF THE TIERING AS FAR AS THE ACTUAL STUDIES, IS THOSE ARE IT IS SUPPOSED TO PUBLISH A NEW VERSION IN THE SUMMER.

SO THAT MAY HAVE ADDITIONAL STUDIES, BUT WE DON'T KNOW THE EXACT TIMING.

IT SAYS SUMMER OR THE FALL. SO, I MEAN, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO LOOK AT IT AGAIN.

AND, YOU KNOW, IF, IF THE REPORTS YOU SAW HAVE A DIFFERENT DATA SET, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO LOOK AT IT.

I MEAN, AT AS BEST AS WE CAN, WE WANT TO REFLECT WHAT THE TRUE COST IS, AND WE JUST WANT TO BE ABLE TO DEFEND IT IF EVER CHALLENGED.

SO. SO WE ARE OPEN TO LOOK AT MULTIPLE SOURCES.

[02:45:05]

ABSOLUTELY. THANK YOU. OKAY. WELL, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, IN TERMS OF STAFF DIRECTION, I WOULD AGAIN BE INTERESTED IN LOOKING AT POTENTIALLY THE STATUTORY MAXIMUM, BUT I ALSO CAN'T SUPPORT THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES.

SO THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. AND LET ME JUST GO BACK.

COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST WAS EXPOSING THE THE ACTUAL OTHER THINGS BESIDES HOUSING, WHICH HOUSING IS WHAT'S IMPACTED OUR COUNTY.

AND THIS IS WHY THE BOARD IS DIFFERENT BECAUSE OF SLOWING THE GROWTH.

SO IF YOU IF YOU THE IMPACT RIGHT NOW ON A 2500 SQUARE FOOT HOME IS 25,000 PER, IS IT ACRE PER SQUARE FOOT? OKAY. SO YOU HAVE 25,000 GOING TO GOING DOWN FOR THE NEXT FIVE YEARS.

IT'S 24 AND EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES IS LESS THAN THE ORIGINAL RIGHT NOW.

SO MAYBE WE SHOULD JUST STAY RIGHT NOW ON WHAT WE'RE ASKING BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, SENIOR ADULT HOUSING.

WHAT'S THE AGE OF THAT 55 AND UP. SO 55. 555 IS GONE.

9000 DOWN TO 7000. AND I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU, BUT I HAVE A LOT OF FRIENDS WITH HIGH SCHOOL KIDS WITH THREE CARS AT 55 YEARS OLD.

I MEAN, THOSE ARE DEED RESTRICTED. SO THEY ARE NOT THESE ARE ONLY DEED RESTRICTED.

DEED RESTRICTED. OKAY, THAT'S GOOD TO KNOW. AND THAT WAS SORRY, THAT WAS A NEW LAND USE THAT AT THE BEGINNING OF THE STUDY, WE TALKED WITH YOUR STAFF SAYING THIS IS OUR CURRENT LAND USES.

DO YOU SEE ANY LAND USES COMING UP THAT YOU CAN'T FIT IT IN ANYWHERE? DO YOU WANT US TO ADDRESS ANYTHING NEW? SO THEY ADDED SOME LAND USES BECAUSE THEY ARE SEEING BEING PERMITTED.

BUT YOU DON'T. I MEAN, THERE IS NO CLEAR DIRECTION ON HOW MANY LAND USES OR WHICH ONES HAVE TO BE IN A FEE SCHEDULE.

SO IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A ALMOST POLICY OR JUDGMENT CALL.

SO, SO IF I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE BOARD THINKS, BUT IF THERE'S SOME NEW NUMBERS THAT ARE COMING OUT IN SUMMER, ARE WE IN A RUSH FOR THE NEXT FIVE YEARS, OR SHOULD WE WAIT FOR THE NEW NUMBERS TO COME OUT OR HAVE IT RELOOKED AT THROUGH THE CHAIR, JUST SO YOU'RE AWARE? SO THE STATUTE CHANGED AND YOU ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE YOUR NEW FEES IMPLEMENTED WITHIN 12 MONTHS FROM THE COMMENCEMENT OF THE STUDY.

IN THE CURRENT INSTANCE, THERE WAS AN AMENDMENT TO THE CONTRACT THAT REQUIRED TO LOOK AT SOME ADDITIONAL DATA.

IF I'M CORRECT. SO THAT WOULD MAKE BY JUNE. SO YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE IT IMPLEMENTED BY JUNE.

UNLESS THERE IS SOME OTHER TRACK YOU'RE TAKING WHERE YOU WOULD EXTEND THAT CONTRACT OR SEEK ADDITIONAL DATA.

AND EVEN FROM THEN IT WOULD STILL BE A 12 MONTH PERIOD.

RIGHT. ONE ONE THING YOU COULD YOU CAN ADOPT THIS STUDY WITHIN THAT 12 MONTH.

AND THEN IF YOU HAVE A NEW DATA SET COMES YOU ALWAYS CAN USE THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES.

AND THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU HAVE TO ADOPT EVERYTHING AT 100%.

IT JUST REMOVES THE TIME FRAMES. THE REMOVES THE 50% CAP.

YOU CAN ADOPT EVERYTHING AT 50%, 60%, 70, WHATEVER IT IS, BUT IT GIVES YOU MORE FLEXIBILITY.

SO IF IF YOU ARE BOUND BECAUSE OF THE TIMELINE AND THEN SOMETHING NEW COMES, THERE'S A WAY TO LOOK AT IT AS MY COMMISSIONER TAYLOR. NO, I JUST WANTED TO SHARE THAT.

YEAH, I APPRECIATE THAT BECAUSE MY CONCERN IS JUST WITH INFLATION.

SO IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT AT DATA FROM 2021, THAT'S NOT GOING TO INCLUDE THE INFLATION THAT WE'VE HAD.

SO THAT WAS MY CONCERN BY IT JUST BEING MORE RECENT IS JUST WE HAVE GOT TO LOOK AT THE INSANE INFLATION THAT WE HAVE HAD JUST IN THE LAST FEW YEARS.

AND SO IT'S HARD TO MAKE A DECISION WITHOUT THAT COMING INTO PLAY.

BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT I MEANT BY BEING ACCURATE, IS THAT WE'VE GOT TO LOOK AT INFLATION AND OUR NEW NUMBERS.

RIGHT. YEAH. FOR THE COST, WE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE WE TRY TO USE MOST RECENT PROJECTS FROM YOUR COUNTY.

2324 AND SO ON. BUT I THINK THE, THE PORTION OF THE DATA THAT'S COULD BE OUTDATED IS THE DEMAND SIDE.

AND THAT LIKE THERE'S A NEW IT MANUAL IS SUPPOSED TO COME OUT THAT MAY CAPTURE SOME OF THAT.

I DON'T KNOW, MISS WEST, IS THERE A WAY TO AMEND THIS SO IT CAN GO LONGER BASED ON DATA? SO YES. IF YOU AMENDED THE CONTRACT AND YOU HAVE NEW DATA, YOU COULD EXTEND YOUR TIME FRAME UNDER 12 MONTHS.

I JUST WANT TO MAKE IT CLEAR TO YOU WITH REGARD TO THE IMPACT FEE AND THE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES, THERE ARE SOME PROCEDURAL REQUIREMENTS THAT COME WITH THAT.

YOU WOULD NEED TO HOLD TWO PUBLIC WORKSHOPS, SEPARATE AND APART FROM YOUR PUBLIC HEARINGS.

AND THE IMPACT FEE ORDINANCE REQUIRES A TWO THIRDS VOTE TO PASS.

CAN WE GO AHEAD AND DO THOSE WORKSHOPS AND SAY WE WANT TO GO TO EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES JUST TO GET ALL THE INFORMATION AND PUSH THIS OUT LONGER? THAT WOULD BE THE DIRECTION THE BOARD WOULD HAVE TO MAKE DIRECTION TO STAFF ON HOW TO PROCEED. THAT, THAT. I DON'T BELIEVE IT GIVES YOU NECESSARILY MORE TIME ON THAT ONE YEAR REQUIREMENT.

IT JUST IF YOU ALREADY IT ALLOWS YOU TO NOT NECESSARILY BE BOUND BY THE CAP OR THAT IT SAYS YOU

[02:50:09]

CANNOT UPDATE OR INCREASE THE FEES MORE THAN ONCE EVERY FOUR YEARS UNLESS THERE ARE EXTRAORDINARY CIRCUMSTANCES.

SO IT REMOVES THAT FOUR YEAR REQUIREMENT SO YOU DON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOUR YEARS.

BUT I THINK THAT ONE YEAR STILL IS IN EFFECT OF THE STUDY TIME PERIOD.

IS THAT RIGHT? CORRECT. YEAH. I JUST THAT WAS ONE OF MY CONCERNS TOO, IS JUST THE NUMBER OF YEARS, EVEN SINCE THE IMPACT FEES HAVE BEEN LOOKED AT.

SO WE'VE HAD ALL THIS INFLATION AND THEY HAVE NOT BEEN ADJUSTED AT ALL.

SO HERE OUR COSTS ARE GOING UP AND UP AND OUR IMPACT FEES HAVE YOU KNOW NOTHING HAS BEEN CHANGED.

SO THAT'S A LONG TIME. SO I THINK IT WOULD BE REALLY IMPORTANT TO TO HAVE THE FLEXIBILITY TO LOOK AT THINGS SOONER AND NOT WAIT YEARS.

IN THE MEANTIME WE'RE PAYING SO MUCH. YOU KNOW, THE INFLATION IS GOING SO, YOU KNOW, OUT OF CONTROL.

YEAH. THROUGH THE CHAIR TO COMMISSIONER TAYLOR, I THINK SOMEBODY CAN COME UP AND EXPLAIN THAT WE DO INDEX OUR FEES EVERY YEAR.

SO THERE HAS BEEN ADJUSTMENTS OKAY. OH SURE. THANK YOU MA'AM.

THROUGH THE CHAIR. COMMISSIONER TAYLOR, TO ADDRESS YOUR QUESTION ON THAT.

IN 2018. THE BOARD SAW FIT THAT THEY WERE. THEY DIDN'T WANT THAT TO HAPPEN.

THEY DIDN'T WANT TO HAVE A LONG PERIOD GO WITH INCREASES IN INFRASTRUCTURE AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

SO WHAT THEY DID WAS PUT AN INDEX ON IT. SO BASICALLY THOSE FEES FOR I THINK IT WAS JUST TRANSPORTATION.

IT WAS THE WHOLE IT WAS THE WHOLE THE WHOLE ONE.

THEY HAD A PERCENTAGE THAT RAN ALONG WITH, I THINK, ENGINEERING NEWS-RECORD OR ONE OF THE STANDARDS IN THE INDUSTRY OF A PERCENTAGE THAT FOLLOW CONSTRUCTION COSTS. AND IT DID GO EVERY YEAR AND IT DID INCREASE.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT MISS NILGUN CAMP WAS INDICATING, THAT WHY YOU SAW A LITTLE BIT OF THE DECREASE OF TRANSPORTATION IMPACT FEES FOR RESIDENTIAL WAS BECAUSE WE DID HAVE THAT INDEX.

SO THE BOARD ACTUALLY DID A REALLY GOOD JOB OF TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE WASN'T SUCH A HUGE LOSS OF MONEY COMING IN.

SO JUST TO CLARIFICATION, BUT THE ONLY THING IS NOW THERE'S A CONCERN AGAIN, THAT BECAUSE IT SAYS YOU CANNOT INCREASE FEES MORE THAN EVERY FOUR YEARS, MOST JURISDICTIONS STOP INDEXING BECAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE AN INCREASE.

WE HAVE ONE JURISDICTION. THEY BASICALLY ADOPTED A FEE SCHEDULE THAT ALREADY INCLUDED THE INDICES.

AND THEY THEY THEY SAID WE DON'T CONSIDER THIS A COST INCREASE.

THIS IS JUST AN ADJUSTMENT. AND THEY SORT OF PUBLISHED IT UPFRONT WITH THE FIRST ORDINANCE.

SO THERE'S ONE EXAMPLE WHERE THEY STILL INDEXED.

MOST EVERYBODY ELSE FEELS LIKE THEY CAN'T INDEX BECAUSE IT'S AN INCREASE.

SO THAT'S ANOTHER THING. SO IF WE TOOK THE IMPACT FEES THAT WE HAVE NOW AND PUT AN INFLATION INCREASE ON IT, THAT WOULD WORK THAT THAT'S CONSIDERED AN INCREASE.

SO YOU CAN'T YOU CAN DO IT FIRST YEAR AND THEN YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO NOT DO IT NEXT FOUR YEARS.

IS IS THE INTERPRETATION OF MOST JURISDICTIONS.

AGAIN, THESE ARE YOU KNOW, THE LEGISLATION DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS INDEXING.

IT JUST SAYS YOU CANNOT INCREASE THE FEES MORE ONCE MORE THAN ONCE EVERY FOUR YEARS.

BUT AGAIN, WE HAVE ONE COUNTY THAT THEIR ATTORNEYS FELT THAT IF THEY PUBLISH UPFRONT, WE'RE INDEXING IT NEXT FOUR YEARS.

THIS IS THE NEW RATE. AND THEN HERE'S THE INDEX RATES.

THAT'S NOT CONSIDERING INCREASE. SO THAT'S SOMETHING TO.

OKAY. COMMISSIONER TAYLOR DO YOU HAVE ANY. NO I JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN I WAS REFERRING TO ALL THAT, IT WAS STRICTLY RESIDENTIAL. I WOULD NEVER DO ANYTHING TO AFFECT THE BUILDING OF EMERGENCY ROOMS OR ANYTHING.

I'M STRICTLY TALKING ABOUT RESIDENTIAL, WHICH IS WHAT WE HEAR SO MUCH ABOUT FROM THE RESIDENTS IN OUR COUNTY.

SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE THAT VERY CLEAR THAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT RESIDENTIAL.

SO DO WE HAVE AN INTEREST IN EXTENDING THIS THE WAY WE SHOULD MAKE THE AMENDMENT TO DO THAT OR FOR DIRECTION? SO THERE'S NO VOTE BEFORE YOU. IT'S JUST PROVIDING DIRECTION TO STAFF.

SO THERE'S NO AMENDMENT. IT'S JUST HOW YOU WANT. WELL, I'M CONCERNED WE'RE GOING TO RUN OUT OF TIME TO DO THE RIGHT THING. DO WE HAVE TO EXTEND IT NOW FOR THE NEW DATA? NO, NO, IT'LL COME BACK.

GO AHEAD. SURE. GO AHEAD. SAY THAT AGAIN, PLEASE. SO TO GET TO GET MORE UPDATED DATA, DO WE NEED TO DO ANYTHING NOW TO EXTEND IT OR DO WE WAIT? WELL, BY JUNE AS OF RIGHT NOW, IS WHEN WE WOULD BE DUE TO HAVE OUR OUR STUDY AND EVERYTHING COMPLETED.

IF YOU HAVE AN AMENDMENT TO THIS CONTRACT WITH THEM AND IT INVOLVES CHANGING THE DATA, THEN THEORETICALLY WE'VE HAD A MODIFICATION AND THERE'S NEW DATA INTRODUCED.

SO WE CAN GO FROM THAT STANDPOINT. WE CAN GO OUT AGAIN.

WOULD IT BE BETTER TO HAVE A SECOND LOOK BY ANOTHER COMPANY OR OR TO EXTEND THIS? OF COURSE THAT'S A BOARD DECISION. YOU KNOW, I THINK NILGUN INDICATED THAT SHE'S WAITING POTENTIALLY FOR THE ITE MANUAL,

[02:55:02]

WHICH IS THE STANDARD IF THAT'S COMING OUT. OF COURSE, THEY CAN LOOK AT THAT.

IF IT IF THERE IS ANY CHANGE, THERE'S NO GUARANTEE THAT IT IS.

SO IT'S AND I'M SORRY, I WOULD SAY THAT WE HAVE AN EXISTING CONTRACT WITH THIS COMPANY.

AND GOING BACK THROUGH THE ENTIRE RFP PROCESS AND ALL THAT, WE HAD ONE INDIVIDUAL APPLY.

IT WENT THROUGH THE STANDARD PROCESS. THAT'S ALL WE HAD.

ACTUALLY APPLY AND GET IT. SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE CHANCES ARE OF GETTING SOMEONE ELSE AS WELL.

SO IF IF THE NUMBERS ARE HIGHER FOR IMPACT FOR RESIDENTIAL HOMES NOW, I DON'T KNOW WHY WE'D EVEN CHANGE IT, BUT I THINK THE NUMBERS NEED TO BE RELOOKED AT BECAUSE WE ALL KNOW WE'RE SITTING IN TRAFFIC AND HAD A PROBLEM IN THE PAST.

I DON'T WANT TO SEE THAT IN THE NEXT FOUR YEARS. SO I'M NOT SURE WHERE TO GO FROM HERE.

MADAM CHAIR, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR MISS KEMP.

HOW LONG WOULD IT TAKE YOU TO COME BACK WITH MORE CURRENT DATA? HOW MUCH TIME WOULD YOU NEED IF WE ARE DOING ACTUAL STUDIES IN THE COUNTY? PROBABLY THREE, FOUR MONTHS. 3 OR 4 MONTHS. IN ADDITION TO DO LIKE AT LEAST 3 TO 5 SITES.

YOU KNOW, BUT PICKING THE SITES, GETTING THE APPROVALS AND SO ON AND SO FORTH.

AND THEY NEED TO BE THE SITES, MATURE SITES THAT ARE REPRESENTATIVE OF FUTURE DEVELOPMENT THAT ARE LIKELY TO.

SO THOSE ARE ACTUAL SITES. SO THAT WOULD BE VERY LOCAL WOULD BE YOUR DATA.

IS IS JUST IT TAKES SOME TIME. AND AND THEN OF COURSE, THERE'S THE EXPENSE OF JUST SO I'M UNDERSTANDING, DO YOU MEAN 3 OR 4 MONTHS FROM TODAY WHERE WE CAN MEET THE JUNE DEADLINE, OR DO YOU NEED AN EXTENSION FROM JUNE 3 OR 4 MONTHS OUT? I THINK WE JUST NEED THREE, FOUR MONTHS AFTER WE ARE APPROVED TO GO AHEAD AND DO THE STUDY.

I SEE. TO GET EVERYTHING ORGANIZED. YEAH. WELL, MADAM CHAIR, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, I TRUST THIS COMPANY.

I TRUST THEIR PROCESS. IF WE WANT TO GET 2024 DATA AND MORE, OR.

I'M SORRY, 2025 DATA, I THINK WE CAN PERMIT THEM TO ANOTHER 3 OR 4 MONTHS, AND WE CAN STILL PERHAPS MEET THE JUNE DEADLINE.

AND THAT WAY WE'D BE WORKING WITH MORE CURRENT NUMBERS. CAN CAN WE DO THAT? BUT BUT IF WE ARE RUNNING UP AGAINST THE JUNE DEADLINE, THEN WE EXTEND IT A LITTLE BIT AT ANOTHER MEETING.

IS THAT WHAT WE DO? POTENTIALLY WE'LL DO OUR BEST WITH THAT.

AND THEN I ALSO TAKE THAT IF THE BOARD. IS THAT A CONSENSUS OF THE BOARD? YEAH. OKAY. AND ALSO THAT'S UNDERSTOOD THAT THERE IS POTENTIAL COST FOR THAT.

SO WE UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'LL BE MORE MONEY PAID FOR THAT. SO WE'RE OKAY.

WELL IT'S JUST GOING FOUR YEARS, FIVE YEARS WITHOUT YOU KNOW, WITH INFLATION AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT WE HAVE CURRENT DATA FOR OUR COMMUNITY, NOT FOR ALL THE AREAS OF FLORIDA.

SO THAT WOULD BE GREAT. AND ONE OTHER THING. YOU COULD PROBABLY DECIDE ABOUT THE OTHER FEES AND LEAVE THE TRANSPORTATION.

IF THERE'S A TIME ISSUE THAT I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, IF LET'S JUST.

DO WHAT WE'RE DOING HERE AND YOU CAN CHECK ALL THE OTHER ONES AT THE SAME TIME.

SO. SURE IS THAT. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU.

THAT'S CLEAR. PRETTY CLEAR. MISS. MISS WEST, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE TASK? IF THEY. YES, I THINK MIKE, IF YOUR GROUP UNDERSTANDS IT, THEN IT'S CLEAR.

I THINK THE DIRECTION IS JUST TO GET UPDATED DATA WITH REGARD TO TRANSPORTATION.

AND IF ANYTHING CHANGES, WE'LL KEEP YOU ABREAST OF IF IT'S NOT AVAILABLE OR IT'S THE SAME, ETC.. OKAY. THERE THERE WAS DIRECTION REGARDING CONSERVATION LANDS AND AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

IS THERE ANY DIRECTION WITH REGARD TO THAT THAT MIGHT MIGHT NEED? I MEAN, FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, I'D LIKE TO SEE US TRY AND MODEL AT LEAST SOMETHING TO PRESENT TO THE BOARD WHAT MODEL OURSELVES AFTER WHAT CLAY COUNTY HAS DONE WITH THEIR AFFORDABLE HOUSING. I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S AN IMPACT FEE WAIVER OR A BUYBACK, BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE US HAVE A HAVE A LOOK AT SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

I WOULD AGREE WITH THAT. YEAH. AND THEN ALSO ON THE TABLE, JUST TO KIND OF GO DOWN THAT LIST, IF YOU DON'T MIND THE THE PRESERVATION EXCUSE ME, CONSERVATION IMPACT FEE.

WHEN WE COME BACK, YOU ALL WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT.

WE'LL GO AHEAD AND KEEP THAT IN THERE UNLESS I HEAR DIFFERENTLY.

WELL. AND SO SO THAT THE PUBLIC UNDERSTANDS THIS IS WHAT NEW HOMES ARE CHARGING THE BUILDERS THIS MONEY.

TOO BAD WE DON'T. WE HAVE TO DO IT. TOO BAD THEY JUST DON'T COME IN AND PAY FOR THE ROADS UP FRONT AND PUT IN A PARK AND THE CONSERVATION AREA WITH THEIR PROGRAMS. SO, YOU KNOW, THIS IS WHAT WE HAVE TO DO. YES, MA'AM.

AND THEN ALSO THE, THE BUY DOWN AKA THE SUBSIDY FOR THE NON RESIDENTIAL.

WE HAD BEEN MOVING FORWARD WITH THAT BEING REMOVED. IS THAT LOOKING FOR DIRECTION THERE AS WELL.

YES. YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. LOOKING TO SEE IF I MISSED ANYTHING ELSE.

TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE CLEAR DIRECTION. OKAY. I THINK WE HAVE OUR MARCHING ORDERS.

[03:00:04]

THANK YOU SO MUCH. REALLY APPRECIATE WORKING WITH US.

I MEAN, YOU ARE WORKING WITH THE BOARD. ANY OTHER COMMENTS BEFORE I THINK WE SHOULD BREAK FOR LUNCH.

SHOULD WE COME BACK AT 1:00? IS THAT ENOUGH TIME? WHAT TIME IS IT NOW? 12. 12. TEN. YEAH. 1:00.

OKAY. THANK YOU. SHE'S HERE. ALL RIGHT. SHOULD WE GET GOING? HOPEFULLY. YOU ALL HAD A GOOD LUNCH OR BREAK.

I WAS TRYING TO GET A FOOD TRUCK, BUT I MIGHT HAVE BEEN TOO COLD TODAY.

[3. WGV Hall of Fame Update and Discussion. Staff will provide an overview of the history of the World Golf Village campus and an update on the property disposition and status of the IMAX operations.]

SARAH MAXFIELD, THANK YOU. GOOD AFTERNOON, CHAIR JOSEPH.

VICE CHAIR, MURPHY. COMMISSIONERS. HAPPY TO BE HERE TODAY TO PRESENT TO YOU AN UPDATE ON THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE.

THERE WE GO. PERFECT. SARAH MAXFIELD, DIRECTOR OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

ALONG WITH THE REST OF OUR TEAM, WE'RE GOING TO SHARE A COMPREHENSIVE OVERVIEW OF THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE CAMPUS AND AN UPDATE OF THE COUNTY STAFF, ACTIVITIES AND EFFORTS AS THEY RELATE TO THIS PROPERTY.

TODAY, WE'RE GOING TO BE COVERING A BRIEF HISTORY OF THE CAMPUS AND HOW IT CAME TO BE THE HALL OF FAME, THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE, AND MORE RECENT HISTORY OF THE COUNTY'S RESPONSE TO THE EXIT OF THE HALL OF FAME AND OTHER ASSETS FROM THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE LOCATION.

WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO A ROBUST DISCUSSION FROM YOU ALL AND HOPING FOR SOME DIRECTION FROM THIS COMMISSION. SO TO START, I'D LIKE TO INTRODUCE MISS TARA MEEKS WITH TOURISM AND CULTURAL DEVELOPMENT. SHE'LL BE SHARING THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE AND HALL OF FAME, AS IT WAS IT WAS ORIGINALLY FRAMED AS A TOURISM DEVELOPMENT PROJECT.

GOOD AFTERNOON, TARA MEEKS, TOURISM AND CULTURAL DEVELOPMENT.

AND AS SARAH SAID, I'M GOING TO BE GOING OVER THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE CAMPUS.

REALLY, IT'S KIND OF ALL STARTED BACK IN THE 1980S, WHEN DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT ACQUIRED A LARGE AMOUNT OF ACREAGE THAT WAS LOCATED BETWEEN SAINT AUGUSTINE AND DUVAL COUNTY, KIND OF IN A VERY RURAL AREA OF THE COUNTY.

THE ACREAGE WAS ORIGINALLY PERMITTED FOR A GENERAL MULTI-USE DEVELOPMENT, AND IT WAS CALLED SAINT JOHN'S HARBOR.

WELL, THEN IN THE 1990S, THE PGA TOUR, WHICH AT THAT TIME STILL HAD A HEADQUARTERS OFFICE UP IN PONTE VEDRA, BEGAN PURSUING THE DEVELOPMENT OF A HALL OF A HALL OF FAME SPECIFICALLY FOR THE TOUR, LOCATED IN SOUTHERN DUVAL COUNTY.

THE INITIAL DESIGN INCLUDED A 28,000 SQUARE FOOT TOUR HALL OF FAME, A 350 ROOM RESORT HOTEL AND AN 18 HOLE GOLF COURSE.

INSPIRED BY THE IDEA. DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT'S PLAN FOR SAINT JOHNS COUNTY FOR SAINT JOHNS HARBOR EVOLVED INTO A RESORT ORIENTED COMMUNITY WITH A GOLF THEME THAT INCLUDED A GOLF HALL OF FAME. AND IN 1991, DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT RECEIVED THE PERMITTING APPROVALS FOR THAT REVISED DEVELOPMENT PLAN, AND SUBSEQUENTLY DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT APPROACHED PGA TOUR ABOUT ALTERNATIVELY LOCATING THEIR PLANNED TOUR HALL OF FAME TO SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

SO OVER THE NEXT TWO YEARS, DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT AND THE PGA TOUR COORDINATED A PLAN FOR MUCH LARGER GOLF FOCUSED DEVELOPMENT.

AS THE PLAN EVOLVED, THE IDEA OF A ONE OF A KIND WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME EVOLVED, AND THAT IDEA WAS PRESENTED TO THE STATE OF FLORIDA AS A WAY TO ATTRACT TOURISTS TO THE SUNSHINE STATE. ULTIMATELY, AFTER THOSE DISCUSSIONS WITH THE STATE, FLORIDA STATUTE 288.1168 WAS PASSED, AND IT OUTLINED THE PARAMETERS OF A WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME FACILITY THAT, IF APPROVED, WOULD BE ELIGIBLE TO RECEIVE STATE FUNDING AND INCENTIVES.

THE STATUTE LISTED AS ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS THAT THE FACILITY HAD TO BE CONSTRUCTED ON LAND OWNED BY A UNIT OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT TO BE ELIGIBLE FOR THIS FUNDING ASSISTANCE.

THE RESULTING PLAN WAS TO FORM A MULTI-ORGANIZATIONAL PARTNERSHIP TO BUILD A ONE OF A KIND, WORLD CLASS FACILITY WITH GOVERNMENT FUNDING ASSISTANCE FOR THE PUBLIC ASSETS.

THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT INCLUDED A 75,000 SQUARE FOOT WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME WITH AN IMAX THEATER, A 400 ROOM RESORT WITH A CONVENTION CENTER, AND 218 HOLE GOLF COURSES THAT WERE BUILT FOR CHAMPIONSHIP PLAY.

A NUMBER OF NEW PARTNERS WERE BROUGHT ON BOARD FOR THE EXPANDED PROJECT, INCLUDING JOHN Q, HAMMONS INDUSTRIES, AND THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION.

SO THEN THERE WAS THE PITCH TO THE COUNTY, WHICH CAME IN 1994 WHEN DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT, JOHN HAMMOND INDUSTRIES AND THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION APPROACHED SAINT JOHNS COUNTY WITH A REQUEST TO FACILITATE THE DEVELOPMENT OF ASSETS WHICH HAD A PUBLIC BENEFIT.

AFTER MUCH DISCUSSION AND NEGOTIATION, IN 1996 THE COUNTY AGREED TO THESE THREE THINGS HERE,

[03:05:04]

WHICH INCLUDED ISSUING BONDS FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE CONVENTION CENTER AND ALLOCATING TOURIST DEVELOPMENT TAX REVENUE TO PAY THE DEBT SERVICE.

ACCEPTING OWNERSHIP OF THE CONVENTION CENTER AND THE LAND UNDER THE CONVENTION CENTER.

ACCEPTING OWNERSHIP OF THE LAND UNDER THE WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME AND THE IMAX BUILDING TO FACILITATE STATE FUNDING ASSISTANCE FOR THAT PORTION OF THE PROJECT.

SO WITH ALL OF THESE PIECES IN PLACE, PROJECT CONSTRUCTION BEGAN IN SUMMER OF 1996.

THE FIRST PHASE OF THE PROJECT INCLUDED THE WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME AND THE IMAX THEATER.

THE RENAISSANCE HOTEL, WITH AN ADDITIONAL 300 ROOMS, THE SLAMMER AND SQUIRE GOLF COURSE, ALONG WITH THE SUPPORTING AMENITIES OF THE CLUBHOUSE AND THE DRIVING RANGE. THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE RETAIL SPACE, WHICH TOTALED 80,000FT².

THE PGA TOUR PRODUCTION HEADQUARTERS. THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE BOULEVARD IN THE ROYAL PINES PARKWAY.

THE SOUTHEAST QUADRANT OF THE COMMERCIAL SITES.

AND MUCH OF THE ASSOCIATED RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT TRACKS.

THE GRAND OPENING OF THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE WAS CELEBRATED IN MAY OF 1998.

THANK YOU, MISS MEEKS. SARAH MAXFIELD AGAIN TO CONTINUE THE STORY.

SO THE COUNTY LEARNED OF THE HALL OF FAME'S DEPARTURE IN JULY 2022 FROM A PRESS RELEASE AND A STORY THAT RESULTED FROM THE PRESS RELEASE FROM THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION. AS TARA HAD EXPLAINED EARLIER, THE HALL OF FAME BUILDING WAS CONSTRUCTED ON LAND OWNED BY THE COUNTY AND LEASED BY THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION, WHICH ENABLED THE PGA TO ACCESS THE FINANCING NECESSARY TO BUILD THE HALL OF FAME BUILDING.

AS OUTLINED IN THE FLORIDA STATUTE 28.1168, THE TERMINATION OF THE GROUND LEASE IN JUNE 2023 TRANSFERRED THE OWNERSHIP OF THE BUILDING TO THE COUNTY. UNDER THE CONTRACT TERMS, SO THE COUNTY CURRENTLY OWNS THE HALL OF FAME AND THE CONVENTION CENTER AND THE GROUND UNDER THE HOTEL COMPLEX.

THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION OWNED THE TOUR PRODUCTION BUILDING, THE PARKING AND THE COMMON AREAS AROUND THE CIRCLE.

THE REMAINDER OF THE PROPERTY IS OWNED BY RIVER CHURCH AND WV COMMERCIAL, INC., AND ATRIUM HOSPITALITY AND HONORS GOLF.

THIS MAP SHOWS THE CURRENT OWNERSHIP. THE PURPLE AREA IS THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION'S OWNERSHIP STAKE.

THE BLUE AREA IS WHAT SAINT JOHNS COUNTY OWNS.

THE GREEN IS RIVER CHURCH. THE YELLOW IS WV WJSV COMMERCIAL LLC, AND THE VERY LIGHT YELLOW AROUND THE THE BOTTOM HALF AND THE SIDE IS HONORS GOLF. FOLLOWING IN SEPTEMBER 2023, SAINT JOHNS COUNTY AND THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION ENTERED INTO A MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING, WHERE THE COUNTY PAID A TOTAL OF 49,500 GRANT FUNDED TO THE FOUNDATION TO MAINTAIN OPERATIONS AT AN AGREED LEVEL OF SERVICE FOR THE MONTHS OF OCTOBER, NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER OF 2023.

AFTER BEGINNING NEGOTIATIONS WITH WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION FOR THE PURCHASE OF THEIR CONTROLLED PROPERTIES, THE FOUNDATION AGREED TO CONTINUE THE MANAGEMENT AND OPERATION OF THE IMAX THEATER AT NO EXTRA COST TO THE COUNTY.

AFTER FURTHER DISCUSSIONS WITH WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION, SAINT JOHNS COUNTY RELEASED A REQUEST FOR PROPOSALS ON NOVEMBER 4TH THIS YEAR, THIS PAST YEAR, 2024, TO TAKE OVER THE MANAGEMENT AND OPERATIONS OF THE IMAX THEATER AND ON AND ON DECEMBER 12TH, 2024, THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION ANNOUNCED IT WAS CEASING OPERATIONS OF THE IMAX THEATER.

ON JANUARY 2ND, THE COUNTY STAFF REJECTED THE SOLE PROPOSAL SUBMITTED FOR THE RFP.

IN THE FALL OF 2023, THE BOC CONTEMPLATED THE OPPORTUNITY TO SHAPE THE DEVELOPMENT OF THIS PROPERTY TO ALIGN WITH THE COMMUNITY'S NEEDS AND VISIONS.

AND ON SEPTEMBER 5TH, 2023, THE BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS AUTHORIZED THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR, OR DESIGNEE TO ENTER INTO NEGOTIATIONS TO ACQUIRE THE PGA PRODUCTION BUILDING AND SOUTH LEGACY TRAIL.

THE COUNTY REQUESTED TWO APPRAISALS FOR THE PROPERTY, AND THE AVERAGE APPRAISED VALUE OF THE TWO APPRAISALS IS 5000 297,500.

I'M SORRY, 5 MILLION. PARDON ME. $5,297,500. IN THE FALL OF 2023, THE COUNTY ALSO ENGAGED A CONSULTANT TO CONDUCT A SERIES OF SERIES OF INPUT SESSIONS FOR THE RESIDENTS AND VISITORS ALIKE, AND GATHER INFORMATION ON WHAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE FOR THE FUTURE OF THIS PROPERTY.

AND WHEN THINKING ABOUT JUST THE IMAX BUILDING, THE MAJORITY OF THE RESPONDENTS 63% PREFER THAT IT CONTINUES TO OPERATE AS AN IMAX THEATER. WHEN ASKED ABOUT WORLD GOLF VILLAGE HALL OF FAME, ALMOST THREE QUARTERS OF RESPONDENTS WOULD LIKE IT TO BE OPERATED FOR SOME OTHER PURPOSE.

[03:10:02]

THESE ARE THE KEY POINTS OF THE PURCHASE AND SALE AGREEMENT THAT WAS OUTLINED.

THE REAL PROPERTY FOR 5297 500 INVENTORY AND MARKS 202 500, AND THE AGREEMENT ALSO INCLUDED THE TERMINATION OF THE HALL OF FAME LEASE WITH THE COUNTY AND THE TDA AGREEMENT.

WE THEN ENTERED INTO A DUE DILIGENCE PERIOD THAT ENDED ON NOVEMBER 27TH, 2024, AND THE TERM OF THAT PURCHASE AND SALE AGREEMENT IS NOW EXPIRED. THIS MAP DEPICTS WHAT THE OWNERSHIP DIVISION WOULD HAVE LOOKED LIKE HAD THE TRANSACTION CLOSED, WITH SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY IN THE BLUE RIVER CHURCH, STILL IN THE GREEN ATRIUM IN THE ORANGE YELLOW WJSV COMMERCIAL AND HONORS GOLF STILL IN THE VERY LIGHT YELLOW.

SO THIS SHOWS THE ATTEMPT TO ASSEMBLE THE PROPERTY FOR A LARGER REDEVELOPMENT PROJECT.

DURING THE DUE DILIGENCE AND FINDINGS TIME. WE LEARNED THAT THERE WAS AN EXISTING PROPERTY USE RESTRICTION THAT LIMITED THE VALUE AND AFFECTS THE PUBLIC INTEREST.

THE USE RESTRICTION REMOVAL REQUIRES A WAIVER FROM THE ORIGINAL DEVELOPER.

THE STATE OF THE SAINT JOHN'S DEVELOPMENT OF REGIONAL IMPACT OR DRY SITE LAND.

SITE LAND EXPRESSED CONCERN THAT THE REDEVELOPMENT OR NEW DEVELOPMENT WOULD ACCELERATE THEIR ROAD IMPROVEMENT OBLIGATIONS.

UNDER THE ORIGINAL DRI AGREEMENT WITH THE COUNTY AND AN SWAGIT LAND ARE HESITANT TO GRANT A WAIVER OF THE USE RESTRICTION WITHOUT ASSURANCES FROM THE COUNTY THAT THEY WILL CONSIDER REDUCING THE DEVELOPER'S ROAD IMPROVEMENT OBLIGATIONS ALONG THE IGP CORRIDOR.

THE USE RESTRICTION OUTLINES A 50 YEAR PERIOD.

IT. IT IS VERY NARROW IN ITS CONSTRUCT, AND IT LIMITS THE ABILITY TO UTILIZE THAT PROPERTY FOR ANYTHING OTHER THAN A HALL OF FAME.

AN 18 HOLE GOLF COURSE. PGA TOUR PRODUCTION FACILITY.

IMAX OR IWERKS AND FOR NO OTHER USE OR PURPOSE.

NOW I'M GOING TO INTRODUCE DAN WHITCRAFT, OUR DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES MANAGEMENT, TO TALK A LITTLE ABOUT THE BUILDING COST AND MAINTENANCE OF THE FORMER HALL OF FAME BUILDING. MADAM CHAIR, COMMISSIONERS, DAN WHITCRAFT, FACILITIES MANAGEMENT.

SO I'M GOING TO TOUCH ON NOW THAT THE BUILDING HAS REVERTED BACK TO THE COUNTY.

I'M GOING TO TOUCH ON OUR COST OF OWNERSHIP. SO AT THE TOP OF THIS, YOU WILL SEE RIGHT NOW, SOME OF THE RECURRING OPERATING COST. THE 9000 IS SOME MANDATED SERVICE AGREEMENTS THAT WE HAVE.

MAINLY WE HAVE ELEVATOR AND WE HAVE. FIRE SPRINKLER SYSTEMS THAT THAT WE HAVE A SERVICE AGREEMENT IN PLACE.

THE RECURRING UTILITIES, ONCE THE BUILDING REVERTED BACK TO US, WE NOW HAVE GENERAL LIABILITY AT THE TUNE OF $61,000 A YEAR.

AND THE BIG ONE IS THE MONTHLY UTILITIES. SO THIS NUMBER HERE COMES FROM HISTORICAL DATA THAT WE GOT FROM THE PREVIOUS OWNERS WHICH WAS ROUGHLY $20,000 A MONTH.

THERE ARE A FEW THINGS SINCE THE BUILDING HAS COME BACK TO US, THAT WE HAVE GONE OUT AND WE HAVE DONE SOME RESETS.

WE DO ANTICIPATE THIS NUMBER BEING LOWER JUST DUE TO TEMPERATURE SETTINGS AND SOME SCHEDULING.

BUT YOU CAN SEE IT IS IT IS A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER.

NONETHELESS, SOME OF THE SHORT TERM NEEDS THE BUILDING DOES NEED TO BE PRESSURE WASHED.

IT'S A VERY LARGE BUILDING. THERE WILL BE A COST ASSOCIATED WITH IT.

THERE IS SOME ORGANIC GROWTH. THAT'S THAT IS CURRENTLY ON THE BUILDING.

I'M SURE IT'S BEEN A NUMBER OF YEARS SINCE IT'S BEEN CLEANED.

WE WILL ALSO CONDUCT AN AUDIT OF THE BUILDING TO SEE ABOUT ANY TYPE OF POTENTIAL WATER INTRUSION.

OBVIOUSLY, THAT WILL COST US DOWN THE ROAD IF WE DON'T ADDRESS THOSE NEEDS NOW.

AND THEN, OF COURSE, JUST GENERAL MAINTENANCE, MAINLY THE MECHANICAL SYSTEM.

THOSE TYPICALLY ARE THE THE LARGER, LARGEST COST ASSOCIATED WITH WITH A BUILDING LIKE THIS.

SOME LONG TERM ASSET INVESTMENT. IF IF THE BUILDING STAYS WITH THE COUNTY.

WE HAVE TWO VERY LARGE CHILLERS. THEY PROVIDE THE CHILLED WATER SYSTEM.

THAT THAT COOLS THE BUILDING. AND THEN WE HAVE ASSOCIATED WATER PUMPS THAT COME WITH IT.

AND THEN, OF COURSE, PROBABLY THE BIGGEST ITEM THAT WILL NEED TO BE ADDRESSED EITHER A SIGNIFICANT ROOF REPAIRING OR AN OVERALL REPLACEMENT OF THE ROOF. WHICH WHICH AGAIN, IS IS GOING TO BE COSTLY.

[03:15:07]

AND THEN LASTLY THE CAMP FEES, THE COMMON AREA MAINTENANCE THAT IS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS BUILDING SPREAD ACROSS THREE DIFFERENT ASSOCIATIONS. FOR THIS PARTICULAR BUILDING COMES IN RIGHT AROUND $370,000 A YEAR.

THAT'S ALL I HAVE. THANK YOU DAN.

SO WE HAVE UP ON THE SCREEN A FEW MAJOR DISCUSSION POINTS TO HELP FACILITATE THE DISCUSSION BETWEEN YOURSELVES AND STAFF.

THE FIRST BULLET POINTS TO A SUBJECT THAT IS OF GREAT PUBLIC INTEREST.

AND COUNTY STAFF HAS BEEN WORKING TO FIND A WAY TO KEEP THE IMAX THEATER OPEN AND ACTIVE.

WE'VE RECENTLY HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH OUR PARTNERS AT THE SAINT JOHNS COUNTY CULTURAL EVENTS, INC. SGC TO SEE IF THERE MIGHT BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO ENGAGE AND PARTNER ONCE AGAIN TO ACTIVATE THIS FACILITY.

AND IN FACT, UNDER THEIR CURRENT PARTNERSHIP AGREEMENT WITH THE COUNTY, SGC HAS THE RIGHT OF FIRST REFUSAL TO CONSIDER THE CONSIDER THE ADDITION OF OPERATION OF IMAX TO ITS CONTRACT. IF IT'S AT YOUR PLEASURE, I WOULD LIKE TO INVITE MR. JERRY WILSON WITH SGC TO SHARE AN OPPORTUNITY TO ACTIVATE THE IMAX THEATER.

I SEE. FIRST, I NEED TO GET OUT OF THIS PLACE SOME MORE.

GOOD AFTERNOON. LET ME GET THIS SET UP TO SHOW THIS PRESENTATION.

OH, THAT'D BE GREAT. THANKS.

FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. WHERE'S THAT? THAT'S RIGHT.

RIGHT HERE.

THANK YOU. SO GOOD AFTERNOON, I'M GERRY WILSON.

AND IT'S GREAT TO SEE YOU. HAPPY NEW YEAR. CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR AND COMMISSIONERS.

THANKS FOR YOUR HARD WORK. MY ADDRESS IS 830-13818 NORTH PONTE VEDRA BEACH.

AND I'M HERE TODAY IN MY CAPACITY AS A MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS OF SJC CULTURAL EVENTS INCORPORATED.

WITH ME IN THE AUDIENCE TODAY IS OUR CHAIR, DYLAN RUMRILL, THE MAYOR OF SAINT AUGUSTINE BEACH, OUR CEO AND PRESIDENT, GABRIEL PELLISSIER. I ALSO WANT TO THANK ELIZABETH GLASGOW, OUR CHIEF ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICER, AND RYAN HALL, OUR CHIEF MARKETING AND PUBLIC RELATIONS OFFICERS, FOR THEIR HARD WORK TO GET US TO THIS POINT.

WE HAVE OTHER EXECUTIVES HERE TOO. BUT JUST AS A QUICK REMINDER, SJC CULTURAL EVENTS, INC.

IS A LOCALLY OWNED, LED AND OPERATED 501 C3 ORGANIZATION, AND WE ARE BOUND BY FLORIDA STATUTE 255.065.

WE'RE THE ONLY PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, AND OUR PURPOSE IS TO CREATE COMMUNITY VALUE THAT IMPROVES QUALITY OF LIFE FOR RESIDENTS AND ATTRACTS TOURISTS THROUGH CULTURAL EVENTS AND VENUES.

QUITE FRANKLY, WE'RE IN THE BUSINESS OF BUILDING EXPERIENTIAL BRANDS THAT CURRENTLY DRIVE OVER $40 MILLION IN ECONOMIC BENEFIT TO SAINT JOHNS COUNTY ANNUALLY. OUR BRAND ESSENCE IS AUTHENTICITY NEVER COMPROMISED.

THAT FORCES US TO FOCUS ON BEING THE VERY BEST.

AND WE MANAGE AND OPERATE FIVE BRANDS TODAY. THE SAINT AUGUSTINE AMPHITHEATER, WHICH IS CURRENTLY RANKED NUMBER TWO IN AMERICA FOR TICKET SALES.

THE PONTE VEDRA CONCERT HALL AND THE NEW A NEW ERA ARRIVES IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS YEAR AS WE WELCOME THE BRAND NEW CONCERT HALL THAT'S BEING SHOWN IN THE PICTURE.

OUR WORLD CLASS FARMERS MARKET, WHICH IS A LOCAL FAVORITE.

THE SING OUT LOUD FESTIVAL, WHICH BROUGHT ALMOST 28,000 PEOPLE TO SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY FROM 49 OF THE 50 STATES JUST LAST YEAR. FORT MOSE JAZZ AND BLUES SERIES, WHICH HONORS THE FIRST FREE AFRICAN SETTLEMENT IN WHAT WOULD BECOME THE UNITED STATES. THESE FIVE BRANDS SPEAK TO THE TANGIBLE EXAMPLE OF THE POWER OF THIS PRIVATE, PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP. IT ALLOWS THE COUNTY TO DO EXACTLY WHAT IT DOES BEST, WHICH IS OWN THE FACILITIES,

[03:20:03]

CONTRIBUTE TO THE UTILITIES AND THE MAINTENANCE AND THE THE GENERAL GROUND ASPECT OF THESE BUILDINGS.

BUT IT ALSO OUTSOURCES ALL OF THE MANAGEMENT AND OPERATION OF LIVE CONCERTS AND ALL OF THOSE THINGS THAT WERE PREVIOUSLY QUITE CHALLENGING. SO WHY AM I HERE TODAY? I RECEIVED AN INVITATION ON JANUARY THE 7TH TO ATTEND A MEETING AT SAINT JOHNS COUNTY WITH STAFF.

THE NEXT MORNING, THE PURPOSE OF THAT MEETING WAS TO DISCUSS THE IMAX.

AND SO THEY ASKED ME EARLY IN THE MEETING IF WE HAD ANY IDEAS.

DOES SJC HAVE ANY IDEAS ABOUT THE IMAX? AND I REPLIED, NO, WE DON'T HAVE ANY IDEAS.

HOWEVER, DURING THE COURSE OF THE DISCUSSION, I DID REITERATE THAT AS A PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP, WE ARE COMMITTED TO OUR COMMUNITY. AND IF WE COULD STEP BACK AND HELP OUT, WE'RE HAPPY TO TO INVESTIGATE THIS.

WHEN THAT MEETING WAS OVER, I GOT IN MY CAR AND DROVE TO THE IMAX.

AND I MET MR. WHITCRAFT THERE, AND HE AND I WALKED THE FACILITY IMMEDIATELY.

SO TODAY, 13 DAYS LATER, I'M REALLY HERE JUST TO SHARE SOME SCENARIOS THAT THE BOARD MIGHT WANT TO CONSIDER.

FIRST, I WANT TO STATE THAT WE'RE NOT HERE TO SELL ANY OF THESE IDEAS.

WE'RE NOT TRYING TO PROMOTE ANY OF THESE IDEAS, BUT WE HAVE TAKEN 12 DAYS TO STUDY THEM AND WE THINK IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL.

A FULL DISCLOSURE WHAT YOU'LL SEE IS OUR BEST CURRENT THINKING AND THE BEST AVAILABLE DATA, AND THINGS CAN CHANGE AS WE GO FORWARD. SO LET ME START BY SCENARIO ONE.

SCENARIO ONE, SIMPLY PUT, IS JUST TO REMAIN CLOSED.

THAT IS AN OPTION. ON DECEMBER 12TH THE IMAX CLOSED TO THE PUBLIC, AND THIS WOULD ENSURE THAT YOU HAVE FULL RANGE OF OPTIONS AHEAD. YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE ANYTHING TO UNDO.

IT'S RIGHT THERE. AND FRANKLY, THIS IS THE EASIEST AND LEAST EXPENSIVE OF THE THREE OPTIONS.

IT DOESN'T REQUIRE ANY FURTHER CAPITAL INVESTMENT, ETC..

SO THAT BEING SAID, I SHOULD POINT OUT THAT IN THE PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT SURVEY THAT WAS FIELDED, 4976 RESPONSES RANKED THE NUMBER ONE REASON FOR VISITING WHAT IS FORMALLY THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE WAS THE IMAX, AND THE SECOND PLACE FINISHER WAS AT 50% VISITED FOR A DINING EXPERIENCE.

AND SO MANY OF THE IMAX TRIPS WERE COUPLED WITH THE DINING EXPERIENCE.

A DISTANT FOURTH, AT 15%, WAS THE HALL OF FAME.

AND SO THERE IS GREAT COMMUNITY SUPPORT FOR THIS PARTICULAR VENUE.

SINCE THE PROPERTY WAS ABANDONED TO MOVE TO NORTH CAROLINA, IT HAS BEEN CLOSED, LIKE I SAID, SINCE DECEMBER 12TH. SO AS WE THINK ABOUT THE PROS AND THE CONS OF THAT, AS I SAID EARLIER, ALL OF THE OPTIONS REMAIN AVAILABLE. THERE IS NO FURTHER CAPITAL INVESTMENT, BUT THERE IS ABOUT A HALF $1 MILLION OF HOLDING COST THAT THE COUNTY WOULD INCUR REGARDLESS BECAUSE OF THE HVAC, BECAUSE OF THE INSURANCE, BECAUSE OF UTILITIES AND MAINTENANCE.

SO THERE IS ACTUALLY A COST OF DOING NOTHING.

AND THE BENEFIT OF THAT WOULD BE THE FLEXIBILITY.

BUT I WOULD LIKE TO REPRESENT THAT THIS COULD BE VIEWED ALSO BY THE PUBLIC AS THEY TOOK TIME TO PROVIDE FEEDBACK.

IT WASN'T LISTENED TO. AND HERE WE ARE. SO THAT'S SCENARIO ONE.

SCENARIO TWO IS TO REOPEN AS A SINGLE USE EMACS.

AND IT'S IMPORTANT TO THINK OF THE EMACS AS A SINGLE USE VENUE.

SO LET'S GO BACK TO 1998 WHEN THIS OPENED IN 1998.

THE TOP TWO MOBILE PHONES WERE A NOKIA AND A MOTOROLA.

THERE WERE OVER 2 MILLION PAYPHONES IN THE UNITED STATES, WHICH IS ONE FOR EVERY 137 PEOPLE IN THE COUNTRY.

AND BLOCKBUSTER WAS ON THE VERGE OF OPENING AND OPERATING THEIR 9,000TH VIDEO STORE.

1998 TO 2007. SUDDENLY, STEVE JOBS INTRODUCES THIS NEW WORLD CALLED THE IPHONE.

AND TODAY 98% OF PEOPLE CARRY A SMARTPHONE AND THEY STREAM CONSTANTLY.

AND THIS IS NO DENIGRATION OF THIS FORMAT WHATSOEVER.

I'M JUST SUGGESTING THAT THE FRAME OF REFERENCE FOR A SINGLE USE EMACS HAS DRAMATICALLY SHIFTED.

SO, CONSISTENT WITH THE PUBLIC INVOLVEMENT SURVEY, BUILDING THIS, THIS BUILDING SEEMS TO BE IN VERY GOOD SHAPE.

[03:25:01]

IT'S ACTUALLY A BEAUTIFUL BUILDING. IT HAS ABOUT 250 50 SEATS THAT ROCK BUT DON'T RECLINE, WHICH SEEMS TO BE IMPORTANT IN THE MOTION PICTURE BUSINESS.

IT DOES HAVE TRADITIONAL POPCORN FACILITIES. FRESH CARPET AND PAINT WOULD BE NICE, BUT IN ESSENCE THE BUILDING IS FINE.

THE RESTROOMS COULD USE A LITTLE BIT OF IMPROVEMENT AS WELL AS SOME COUNTER WORK.

BUT LET'S REMEMBER THE IMAX IS A SINGLE USE VENUE AND IT HAS VERY STRICT FRANCHISE REQUIREMENTS SUCH AS ANY FILM SHOWN MUST USE THE IMAX FORMAT IF IT'S AVAILABLE. THOSE FILMS ARE TAXED AT 5% OF ROYALTIES THAT ARE PAID BACK TO IMAX.

THE IMAX WAS ONLY OPEN THREE DAYS A WEEK, AND THE CUSTOM IMAX MOVIE PROJECTION EQUIPMENT, WHICH INCLUDES COMPUTERS AND ALL KINDS OF SPECIAL EQUIPMENT, DOES NOT HAVE THE LASER TECHNOLOGY WHICH IS CURRENTLY USED IN MOST IMAX WE DO.

SAINT JOHN'S JOHNS COUNTY OWNS THE EQUIPMENT AND THE SCREEN, AND THERE'S A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT ANNUAL COST FOR MAINTENANCE THROUGH IMAX.

IRONICALLY, JUST LAST WEEK, WE RECEIVED AN EMAIL THAT IMAX HAS INSPECTED THE 80 FOOT WIDE CUSTOM SCREEN, AND IT NEEDS TO BE IMMEDIATELY REPLACED. NOW, THIS IS A BIG DEAL BECAUSE IT'S A HUGE CUSTOM SCREEN.

IT'S A ROUNDED SCREEN, AND WHEN IT WAS INSTALLED, IT TOOK 50 PEOPLE TO LIFT THIS UP OVER THE CHAIRS.

IT'S QUITE A QUITE A DRAMA TO GET THAT REPLACED.

SO ADDITIONALLY, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT ALL OF THESE PARTICULAR IMPROVEMENTS, WE'RE LOOKING AT BASICALLY ABOUT A $1.2 MILLION INVESTMENT PLUS THE RECURRING, YOU KNOW, HALF $1 MILLION IN MAINTENANCE AND SUCH FOR THE IMAX.

FINALLY, THE IMAX DID AWARD ANOTHER FRANCHISE ONLY 14 MILES FROM THIS FACILITY TO EPIC THEATERS.

SO THEATERS, SO THEY ARE OPERATING TWO IMAX SCREENS RIGHT NOW, WHICH FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGES THE COMPETITIVE SET, I THINK FOR THE. FOR THE IMAX. THE COMMUNITY DEFINITELY SEEMS TO SUPPORT THIS, THIS, THIS OPTION, BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT'S THE MOST EXPENSIVE OF THE THREE.

SO SCENARIO THREE IS DESIGNED TO TRY AND ADDRESS THE UNDERLYING VALUE OF IMAX WHILE ATTRACTING A BROADER AUDIENCE.

REPURPOSED THE EXISTING VENUE TO A MULTI-USE COMMUNITY THEATER.

THIS WOULD START BY INCLUDING FIRST RUN MOVIES, SO THAT WOULD MEAN THAT WE WOULD NEED TO GET ANOTHER MOVIE PROJECTOR, BUT NOT THE IMAX, WHICH IS DRAMATICALLY LESS EXPENSIVE, WHICH COULD BE LEASED SO THAT IF IT EVER HAD A MAINTENANCE PROBLEM, COULD BE SUBBED OUT, AND THEN A MORE TRADITIONAL SCREEN THAT WOULD GIVE MUCH MORE USE TO TO DIFFERENT TYPES OF SITUATIONS.

THERE ARE ABOUT 8 TO 10,000 HOUSEHOLDS WITHIN TEN MILES OF THE FACILITY, AND SO A FRESH APPROACH COULD ALSO HELP PEOPLE TO COME MORE OFTEN. CANDIDLY, THE ISSUE HERE IS NOT REACH ITS FREQUENCY.

AND SO IF WE CAN GET MORE FREQUENCY OF USE THEN THIS COULD BE MORE SUCCESSFUL.

AND SO WHEN YOU ALSO ADD THE CONVENTION CENTER AND THE TOURISTS THAT WOULD BE OPEN TO USING THIS WHILE THEY'RE IN IN OUR COUNTY.

IT HAS GREAT APPEAL FOR TOURISM. AND SO WE DECIDED TO TAKE A LOOK AT IT, AN OCCASION BASED CONSUMER SEGMENTATION MODEL THAT WE'RE CALLING EXIT 323. THAT'S OUR CODE NAME BECAUSE THAT'S THE EXIT ON I-95.

SO IT'S NOT THAT BRAINY, BUT YOU KNOW IT TELLS YOU WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

THIS WOULD BE A DESTINATION FOR PEOPLE SEEKING MORE VARIETY.

AND IT WOULD BE A SEVEN DAY A WEEK TYPE OF VENUE OPEN SPECIFICALLY FOR SPECIFIC OCCASIONS AND SPECIFIC CONSUMERS.

SO LET'S TAKE THIS AS AN EXAMPLE. CONCEPTUALLY, SUNDAY WOULD BE A TOGETHERNESS TYPE OF FAMILY OPPORTUNITY WITH A MATINEE SHOWING. IT WOULD ALSO BE AN EVENING SOCIAL.

THERE ARE MANY ADULTS AND BABY BOOMERS WITHIN FIVE MILES OF THIS PARTICULAR VILLAGE, AND IT WOULD ALLOW THEM TO COME IN AND HAVE SOMETHING IN THE EVENING TO DO WITH OR WITHOUT FAMILY MEMBERS, BUT A PLACE TO SOCIALIZE.

MONDAY WOULD BECOME A NOSTALGIA OCCASION. WEDNESDAY WOULD BE MID-WEEK PICK ME UP FOR ALL AGES.

THURSDAY, WHICH IS OFFICIALLY FRIDAY EVE, WOULD BE A PLACE WHERE TEENS AND YOUNG ADULTS WOULD BEGIN TO START THEIR WEEKEND.

FRIDAY WOULD BE A WEEKEND KICKOFF WITH TEENS AND YOUNG ADULTS.

AND THEN SATURDAY WOULD BE FAMILY FUN WITH MATINEE AND THEN AN EVENING OUT.

AND SO AS WE LAY OUT A POTENTIAL MONTHLY CALENDAR FOR THIS, THIS STRATEGY SUNDAY WOULD BECOME A BEHAVIORAL TYPE OF DAY.

PEOPLE WOULD BEGIN TO REALIZE WHAT SUNDAY, MONDAY, TUESDAY, EACH DAY OF THE WEEK WOULD REPRESENT.

AND SO IMAGINE ON SUNDAY, A 2 P.M. FAMILY MATINEE FILM WHERE THE FAMILY COULD GO AND ENJOY THIS WITH OUR

[03:30:09]

GRANDPARENTS. COULD GO AND ENJOY THIS WITH THE, YOU KNOW, MUFASA, THE LION KING SHOW OR WHAT HAVE YOU.

BUT THEN THAT AFTERNOON, THAT EVENING, THE VENUE WOULD BE CONVERTED TO AN ADULT SOCIAL HOUR BEGINNING AT FIVE.

SO EARLIER IN THE AFTERNOON, FOR, YOU KNOW, BOOMERS THAT LIKE TO GET OUT EARLIER AND HAVE MAYBE A DRINK AND SOME FOOD AND THEN SEE A SHORT FILM.

YOU KNOW, IMAGINE SHOWING A SHORT FILM OF SHERLOCK JUNIOR IN 1924, CLASSIC FILM OF BUSTER KEATON.

IT'S A 47 MINUTE FILM. SO IN THE COURSE OF AN HOUR AND 47 MINUTES, THERE'S SOMETHING TO DO ON A ON A SUNDAY NIGHT.

THEN WE CONVERT TO MONDAY, WHICH IS ABOUT NOSTALGIA.

THE REASON THIS IS LAID OUT THIS WAY, IS THAT WE BELIEVE THAT FAMILIES AND PARENTS AND HIGH SCHOOL KIDS ARE BUSY MONDAY, TUESDAY AND WEDNESDAY. SO LET'S FOCUS ON THE ADULTS AND THE BOOMERS WITH VINTAGE FILMS. AND THE IDEA HERE IS TO SHOW CLASSIC FILMS THAT ARE THEY'RE SO NOSTALGIC THAT YOU WANT TO REVISIT THOSE LIKE JAZZ ON A SUMMER'S DAY IN 1959, WHICH WAS A 1958 NEWPORT JAZZ FESTIVAL FEATURING LOUIS ARMSTRONG AND THELONIOUS MONK AND CHUCK BERRY AND ET CETERA.

OR NEXT WEEK, THE MONTEREY POP FESTIVAL. OR, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THESE CLASSIC FILMS OF WOODSTOCK AND THESE, THESE MOVIES THAT GO BACK IN TIME WITH MUSIC.

THEN TUESDAY WOULD SHIFT OVER AND THIS WOULDN'T ALL BE MUSIC FILMS, BUT OTHER VINTAGE FILMS ONCE AGAIN STARTING EARLIER IN THE EVENING AND HAVE AN OCCASION ON THE FRONT SIDE. TUESDAY, WE THINK, WOULD BE A GREAT NIGHT FOR A LECTURE, A CURATED LECTURE SERIES, SO YOU WOULD ONCE AGAIN COME IN IN THE EVENING EARLY, HAVE SOME ENGAGEMENT WITH YOUR FRIENDS, AND THEN GO IN AND SEE A LECTURE SERIES OF TOPICS THAT WOULD BE OF GREAT INTEREST.

ONCE AGAIN, A 40 MINUTE, 45 MINUTES TYPE OF THING.

THEN WE GET INTO WEDNESDAY WHERE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT POTENTIAL COMEDY SPECIALS, AND THEN HAVE LOCAL MUSICIANS, START UP BANDS THAT ARE LOCAL OR HIGH SCHOOL BANDS OR OTHER BLUEGRASS GROUPS THAT ARE PLAYING TO COME IN AND ACTUALLY PLAY IN THERE WITH THE NEW SCREEN WOULD HAVE THE FLEXIBILITY TO HAVE A MUCH WIDER STAGE. CURRENTLY, IT COMES ALL THE WAY TO THE GROUND, SO YOU'VE ONLY GOT ABOUT EIGHT FEET TO WORK WITH.

THURSDAY. THEN WE WOULD GO BACK INTO THE FIRST RUN MOVIE, THE FIRST RUN MOVIE, AND THEN BACK TO A MATINEE AND A FIRST RUN MOVIE.

AND IDEALLY, MAYBE THE THIRD WEEK OF EVERY MONTH, WE WOULD HAVE A THEMED FILM FILM FESTIVAL WITH A OPENING NARRATOR TO TAKE PEOPLE THROUGH THAT. SO GIVEN THE UPSCALE DEMOGRAPHICS OF THE VISITORS AND THE RESIDENTS, WE WOULD ALSO INCLUDE AN UPGRADED FOOD AND BEVERAGE PLATFORM THAT WOULD BE CREATED. THIS WOULD INCLUDE ADULT BEVERAGES, CULINARY OFFERINGS PREPARED UNDER THE GUIDANCE OF A LOCAL CHEF BASED ON THAT OCCASION.

THIS WOULD ALSO BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO GET A WIDER VARIETY OF FOOD AND BEVERAGE FOR TEENS AND CHILDREN, AND ADULTS LOOKING FOR A HEALTHIER FARE. THE BEAUTY OF THIS IS THAT SAINT JOHNS COUNTY RETAINS OWNERSHIP OF THE VENUE.

WOULD BECOME THE OPERATOR OF THE COMMUNITY THEATER, AND GIVEN THE UNKNOWN FUTURE OF THE VILLAGE, WE WOULD NOT BE LOOKING AT SOME LONG TERM AGREEMENT.

WE WOULD JUST OPERATE IT AS IS IN OUR PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP FRAMEWORK THAT WE OPERATE TODAY.

AND THIS WOULD ENSURE THE GREATEST FLEXIBILITY, THE CUSTOMIZED PROGRAMING WE THINK SHOULD DRIVE GREAT FREQUENCY OF VISITS.

THE CLOSED CAFE, WHICH IS ONLY ABOUT 50FT FROM THE FRONT OF THIS BUILDING, COULD BE USED FOR THE KITCHEN ELEMENTS SO WE CAN REPURPOSE THAT AREA AND PERHAPS EVEN OPEN THAT UP FOR, YOU KNOW, WEEKENDS. THE SCENARIO IS SIGNIFICANTLY LESS COSTLY THAN THE IMAX, BUT THEN KEEPING THE IMAX, IT'S MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE, AND IT COULD BE A SITUATION WHERE THE START UP COST AND SOME OF THE REFURBISHING OF THE BUILDING, WHICH ISN'T THAT MUCH WE COULD WORK THROUGH WITH COUNTY ON HOW BEST THAT WOULD BE SITUATED.

THE COST OF PROGRAMING IS QUITE HIGH BECAUSE WE'RE DOING SO MANY THINGS THROUGHOUT THE MONTH, AND THAT WOULD BE ON ME TO FIGURE OUT THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW WE WOULD DO THE PROGRAMING, HOW WE WOULD AFFORD THAT FROM TICKET SALES AND THE EXPENSES OF OPERATING THIS PARTICULAR VENUE, GIVEN THE IMPACT TO TOURISM, POTENTIALLY EVEN BED TAX COULD BE A, YOU KNOW, A POTENTIAL SOURCE OF SOME OF THE REVENUE.

SO THIS IS A SUMMARY OF SOME OF THE THE PROS AND CONS OF THAT.

AND I'VE ALREADY COVERED MOST OF THEM. ONE OF THE PERCEPTIONS IS THAT THERE COULD BE A NEGATIVE PERCEPTION OF THE IMAX LEAVING.

[03:35:07]

IT FEELS LIKE A BIG THING THAT'S GOING AWAY. I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE TICKET SALES WOULD NOT WARRANT THAT FEELING.

OVER THE LAST YEAR OR TWO. BECAUSE WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE ATTENDEES THAT GO TO THE IMAX, THERE WERE SHOWS THAT WERE HAPPENING IN THE LAST THREE MONTHS WHERE ONE PERSON WAS IN THE THEATER. AND IF ONE PERSON SHOWS UP, IT HAS TO SHOW.

SO THAT'S NOT EXACTLY AN EFFICIENT USE. THERE ARE A FEW START UP COSTS, BUT NOT MILLIONS, JUST ENOUGH TO GET GOING AND GET THE EQUIPMENT SET UP AND BE READY.

AND THEN SOME RECURRING COSTS. SO IN CONCLUSION, I WOULD STATE THAT AS I STARTED, WE'RE NOT HERE TO SELL ANY OF THESE THREE.

WE CHOSE TO DEVELOP A THIRD SCENARIO JUST FOR THE BOARD TO THINK ABOUT.

I WOULD SAY THAT IN STUDYING THE 350 PAGE RESPONSE FROM THE STUDY THAT WAS DONE, THERE'S A LOT OF INTEREST IN THE IMAX, AND THERE'S A LOT OF HOPE THAT THAT IMAX WILL BECOME SOMETHING.

AND AS I STOOD IN THE BUILDING, I TEND TO PERSONIFY ANONYMOUS INANIMATE OBJECTS.

I WOULD TELL YOU THAT'S IT'S A VERY QUIET, DARK, NERVOUS BUILDING.

IT'S GIVEN 26 YEARS, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S IN GOOD SHAPE.

IT'S GIVEN ITS TIME AND IT'S YOU CAN FEEL THAT.

IT WONDERS WHAT'S NEXT FOR ITS FUTURE. AND CANDIDLY, THAT'S UP TO THE BOARD TO TO TO CONSIDER.

BUT I REALLY APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE WORKED WITH COUNTY STAFF TO BRING THESE IDEAS TO YOUR FOREFRONT TO CONSIDER. AND I'M AVAILABLE IF YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS.

DOES THE BOARD HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, OR DO WE WANT TO HEAR THE REST OF THE WORLD GOLF. COMMISSIONER MURPHY? YEAH, JUST JUST A FEW THOUGHTS. DO WE DO WE HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT THE NUMBERS ARE FOR THE IMAX AT AT EPIC? ARE THEY ARE THEY BIG NUMBERS OR. I HAVE NO IDEA.

I KNOW IT'S TWO OF A DOZEN SCREENS. SO IT'S IT'S EMBEDDED IN A LARGE THEATER.

AND I KNOW THIS MIGHT BE A SILLY QUESTION, BUT PARKING OR DO WE HAVE THE PARKING TO SUPPORT SOME OF THE IDEAS THAT YOU'RE DOING IN OPTION THREE? THAT'S ONE OF THE DISCUSSIONS WITH THE COUNTY ABOUT THE AVAILABILITY OF PARKING.

THERE'S STILL OTHER DETAILS TO WORK OUT. OF COURSE.

THAT WOULD BE ONE OF THEM. THAT'S ON OUR LIST OF QUESTIONS TO ANSWER.

STILL LIQUOR LICENSE. IS THERE SOMETHING YOU HAVE THERE ALREADY, OR IS THAT ANOTHER? WE WOULD USE THE EXISTING CONCESSIONAIRE THAT WE USE FOR THE AMPHITHEATER SO THEY WOULD BE READY TO COME IN AND GET THAT ORGANIZED AND DO ALL OF THE NECESSARY PERMITTING.

ONE OF THE BIGGEST DRAWS FOR THE IMAX OVER THE YEARS HAS BEEN SCHOOLS FOR FIELD TRIPS.

I KNOW I'VE BEEN THERE SEVERAL TIMES WITH KIDS AND NOW GRANDKIDS WITH THAT OPTION STILL BE AVAILABLE.

ABSOLUTELY. WE WOULD WELCOME IT. THE MORE THE BETTER.

THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. I JUST HAVE ONE COMMENT, COMMISSIONER TAYLOR.

YEAH, I KNOW THAT YOU MENTIONED, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES THERE WOULD ONLY BE ONE PERSON IN THE IMAX WATCHING A FILM. A LOT OF THAT HAD TO DO WITH THE FILMS THAT THEY WERE SHOWING.

I MEAN, YOU CAN'T REALLY COMPARE BECAUSE THEY WERE THEY WERE NOT SHOWING, YOU KNOW, TOP, TOP FILMS BECAUSE YOU GET OTHER MOVIE THEATERS.

THEY'RE PACKED. SO I THINK A LOT OF THAT HAD TO DO WITH WHAT WAS BEING SHOWN.

I'M NOT SURPRISED TO HEAR THAT. AND THE IMAX FRANCHISE MODEL REQUIRES THAT SHOW TO BE SHOWN 30 DAYS IN A ROW, 30 DAYS. AND SO THAT REALLY IS ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE.

IF YOU RIGHT NOW, I THINK YOU'VE GOT TO BE VERY NIMBLE IN THE IN THIS OCCASION BASED STRATEGY TO TO GIVE NEW REASONS TO COME TO THAT PLACE.

MY COMMENT IS THAT WE HAD AN IMAX SEAT, THAT WE HAD A THEATER SUN-RAY CINEMA WHO WANTED TO COME IN BEFORE AND SHARE THE PROFIT WITH US, AND I BROUGHT IT TO THE BOARD.

I BROUGHT IT TO THE ADMINISTRATOR AND IT WENT NOWHERE.

SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S REALLY UPSETTING THAT WE DIDN'T TAKE JUMP ON THAT WHEN WE DID A YEAR AGO, BUT THANK YOU. DO YOU HAVE ANY KIND OF MONETARY HOW MUCH WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO PUT INTO IT FOR FREE? I WORK FOR FREE. WE HAVE SOME PRO FORMAS. YES, ON THOSE THREE OPTIONS.

AND SO YOU KNOW, WE COULD GO THROUGH THOSE. THEY'RE NOT TIGHT ENOUGH YET TO BE, I THINK REALLY COMFORTABLE TO GO INTO TO GET THE ACCURACY BECAUSE I THINK THE TAXPAYER, YOU KNOW, PART WOULD BE IMPORTANT. YEAH. I THINK WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO AVOID MUCH OF THAT, IF ANY.

OKAY. THANK YOU. ALL YOU. HELLO AGAIN. SO WE DO HAVE JUST A FEW DISCUSSION POINTS. YOU KNOW, FOR YOU ALL TO OPINE ON.

WE'RE HOPING FOR SOME DIRECTION, WHETHER IT BE, YOU KNOW, MOVE FORWARD WITH JCC AND HELP THEM FLESH OUT A BETTER A MORE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN WITH WITH NUMBERS. IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN ENTERTAINING THE IDEA OF OF DIVESTING OF THE PROPERTIES,

[03:40:08]

IF YOU'RE ENTERTAINING THE IDEA OF REENTERING NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION FOR THE OTHER PROPERTIES, WE'RE HERE TO HEAR IT ALL. I'M SORRY. AT THE BACK OF THE PRESENTATION, IT HAD SOMETHING ABOUT AN RFP OR.

I MEAN, WHERE ARE WE WITH THE REST OF THE THE THE BUILDINGS THAT WE OWN.

LIKE, WHAT DID YOU HAVE A IT SAYS WORLD GOLF VILLAGE PROPERTIES LONG TERM VISION ON FEBRUARY 2024.

TWO. ARE WE THAT'S GONE OR WHAT DO WE? WE DIDN'T PUT OUT AN RFP OR WHAT'S THE SITUATION? WE DID NOT. IT WAS WE DIDN'T PUT IT OUT BECAUSE WE COULD NOT PUT OUT AN RFP FOR PROPERTIES THAT WE DID NOT YET OWN.

WE HAD EXPECTED TO OWN THEM BY THEN. AND THAT WAS THE DIRECTION GIVEN BY THIS BOARD AT THAT TIME WAS TO START WORKING ON THAT.

BUT WE COULDN'T DO THAT UNTIL WE OWNED THE PROPERTIES.

AND THAT WAS PRIOR TO UNDERSTANDING THE USE RESTRICTION AND, AND THE, THE WAY IN WHICH THAT WOULD, YOU KNOW, KEEP US FROM DOING WHAT WE REALLY WANTED TO DO OUT THERE. SO I DID I DID HEAR THERE WAS A LARGE CHURCH AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF THE THE PEOPLE ALREADY THERE WANTED TO BUY THE WHOLE PROPERTY.

YOU COULDN'T, YOU KNOW, MAKE AN AGREEMENT WITH THE PGA TO TAKE IT AWAY AND SO THAT WE COULD SELL IT.

I AM NOT AWARE OF THAT PARTICULAR REQUEST. I DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING.

CAN WE JUST SELL IT TO THEM OR DO WE STILL HAVE THE THE RESTRICTIONS, WE WOULD STILL HAVE THE RESTRICTIONS.

WELL RICH COMMANDO CAN WE I MEAN, OKAY, SO WE HAVE A LOT OF STATUTES THAT GUIDE US ON HOW TO GET RID OF SURPLUS PROPERTY.

SO ONE OF THE FIRST STEPS IN THAT PROCESS WOULD BE PUTTING THAT PROPERTY AS A SURPLUS, AND SAYING THAT WE NO LONGER HAVE A COUNTY USE FOR THE PROPERTY, BUT THAT'S A DETERMINATION THIS BOARD WOULD HAVE TO MAKE AND WOULD WOULD NEED A MEETING WHERE WE BROUGHT THAT ITEM FORWARD.

I FEEL LIKE WE'VE HAD THIS PROPERTY FOR TWO YEARS NOW, AND I DID VOTE AGAINST EVEN EVEN GOING FORWARD WITH IT AND TRYING TO DIVEST OF IT.

AND IT'S LIKE A MONEY PIT FOR OUR TAXPAYERS. AND I'M NOT SURE I DON'T HEAR THAT.

YOU GUYS HAVE AN IDEA OR COMMISSIONER TAYLOR.

NO, I AGREE, I'VE HEARD SO OFTEN FROM PEOPLE THAT THEY DO NOT THINK THAT THE COUNTY SHOULD BE IN THE REAL ESTATE BUSINESS, AND A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE WERE REALLY UPSET THAT WE PURCHASED THIS FROM THE VERY BEGINNING.

AND NOW THE FACT THAT IT'S BEEN ALL THIS TIME AND IT HAS BEEN TURNED INTO A MONEY PIT.

I'M JUST THINKING ABOUT THE RESIDENTS, AND I'VE HAD SO MANY CONTACT ME, AND I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION.

THAT'S WHAT YOU KNOW, THAT'S BEST FOR OUR RESIDENTS.

THROUGH THE CHAIR, IF I MAY. SURE. THE COUNTY DID NOT PURCHASE THIS PROPERTY.

WE HAVE NOT MOVED FORWARD WITH ANY TYPE OF PURCHASE.

THIS BUILDING REVERTED BACK TO THE COUNTY UNDER THE TERMS OF THE GROUND LEASE THAT WAS EXECUTED WAY BACK IN THE 90S.

SO THE ADMINISTRATION, THE PREVIOUS BOARD. NOBODY MADE A CONSCIOUS DECISION TO ACQUIRE THIS PROPERTY.

IT REVERTED TO US. WE DID NOT HAVE A CHOICE. I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO SELL, THOUGH, WHAT WE HAD AT SOME POINT AT THE END OF THE YEAR AND PUT OUT AN RFP, BUT THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN. THAT THAT DID NOT HAPPEN, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, AND I DON'T RECALL ANY THING IN MY RESEARCH THAT HAD THIS, THIS BOARD VOTING ON SELLING THAT PROPERTY. COMMISSIONER MURPHY, THAT'S ON THE TABLE.

I MEAN, YOU ALL CAN DECIDE TO DO THAT. ALL RIGHT.

THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. MY QUESTION WOULD BE SO OUR OUR CHALLENGE HERE IS THAT THE ORIGINAL DEVELOPERS ARE ON THE HOOK FOR A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR TRANSPORTATION AND ON IGP OR IN THIS PARTICULAR AREA, AND THEY'RE NOT WILLING TO CHANGE THE RESTRICTIONS UNLESS WE RELEASE THEM FROM THEIR RESPONSIBILITY, THEIR FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY GOING FORWARD.

IS THAT RIGHT? THAT'S PART OF THE NEGOTIATION.

YES. OKAY. SO WE'RE KIND OF STUCK BETWEEN A ROCK AND A HARD PLACE WHEN IT COMES TO THAT.

AND DO YOU SEE ANY OPPORTUNITIES GOING FORWARD TO WHERE WE CAN.

DOES IT MAKE SENSE. AND MAYBE THIS SHOULD BE FOR THE BOARD.

DOES IT MAKE SENSE FOR US TO RELEASE THEM OF THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES IN ORDER TO DO SOMETHING WITH THIS PROPERTY? HOW HOW DOES THE MONEY BALANCE OUT? I MEAN, SHOULD WE STICK TO OUR GUNS AND CONTINUE TO TO TO REQUIRE THE ORIGINAL DEVELOPERS TO PUT THAT MUCH MONEY, OR IS IT IS IT ENOUGH MONEY TO BE WORTH TO FIGHT FOR THIS? SO I GUESS SO. LIKE YOU SAID, THAT'S REALLY A POLICY DECISION FOR THE BOARD.

WHETHER OR NOT YOU WANT TO COMPROMISE ON SOMETHING TO ACQUIRE SOMETHING ELSE IS ENTIRELY YOUR PURVIEW.

COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST. THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. JUST TO REFRESH THE BOARD'S MEMORY, OF COURSE, WE HAVE NOT PURCHASED THIS PROPERTY. BUT WHAT WE DID DO IS EXPRESS AN INTEREST IN ACQUIRING IT AND WHAT WE'VE BEEN DOING SINCE.

JUST SIMPLY EXPRESSING AN INTEREST IN ACQUIRING IT IS UNTANGLING THIS RAT'S NEST.

[03:45:04]

ONE TANGLED STRING AT A TIME. AND WHAT WE'VE DISCOVERED IS THAT THERE'S A LOT OF MOVING PARTS, MORE SO THAN OUR IN OTHER COMPLEX DEALS. THIS IS MORE COMPLEX THAN OTHER DEALS.

BUT WE WERE REALLY TRYING TO DO THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE BY EXPRESSING INTEREST IN ACQUIRING THE PROPERTY.

BECAUSE THE FEAR, WHICH IS THE FEAR ALL OVER THIS COUNTY, IS THAT WE LEAVE IT TO THE FREE MARKET, WHICH GOD BLESS THE FREE MARKET. BUT YOU KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO GO IN THERE IS MULTIFAMILY. THAT'S WHAT THE FREE MARKET WANTS.

I'VE SEEN SEVERAL EXAMPLES OF PEOPLE WHO WOULD LOVE TO COME IN AND BUILD MULTIFAMILY TO SUPPORT A NEW TAKE ON THE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT THAT BELONGS IN THERE, BECAUSE WHAT THEY'VE SEEN OVER THE LAST 30 YEARS IS ANY COMMERCIAL THAT GOES INTO THIS PROPERTY FAILS.

SO THE FREE MARKET HAS DONE TRIAL AND ERROR AND TRIAL AND ERROR.

BUT FOR CADDYSHACK, AND I'M TELLING YOU, WHEN THERE'S A NUCLEAR HOLOCAUST, IT'LL BE THE ROACHES AND THE CADDYSHACK SURVIVING.

GOD BLESS THOSE GUYS. THE MURRAY BROTHERS GOT IT FIGURED OUT BECAUSE THAT RESTAURANT IS FANTASTIC.

IT'S WORKING. BUT BUT FOR CADDYSHACK AND NOW REVERB CHURCH.

NOTHING HAS WORKED BACK THERE. SO THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM AMONGST THE FREE MARKET, THOSE WHO ARE IN THE DEVELOPMENT BUSINESS, IS WE GOT TO BUILD A LOT MORE MULTIFAMILY. WE NEED MORE, MORE PEOPLE TO SUPPORT THE SUPPORT THE COMMERCIAL BACK THERE.

SO I THINK THE BOARD'S THOUGHT PROCESS AT THE TIME WAS, WELL, WAIT, LET'S NOT JUST LEAVE IT TO THE WILL OF THE FREE MARKET.

LET'S SEE IF WE CAN FIND COMMUNITY USES OR COMMERCIAL USES THAT DO NOT INVOLVE BUILDING MORE MULTIFAMILY HOMES, WHICH WILL ADD TO WHAT WE ALREADY KNOW IS A SERIOUS TRAFFIC SITUATION THERE.

SO WE HAVE NOT PURCHASED THE PROPERTY. BUT BUT I THINK THE BOARD'S DISCUSSION WAS WE NEED TO HAVE SOME CONTROL OVER THE WAY THAT THIS IS DEVELOPED SO THAT WE DON'T, NUMBER ONE, RUIN A GREAT OPPORTUNITY TO USE THIS PREMIUM LAND FOR DEVELOPMENT.

AND NUMBER TWO, WE DON'T ALLOW IT TO BECOME SOMETHING THAT WILL GET OR ADD TO THE PROBLEM THAT ALREADY EXISTS IN THIS PART OF OUR COUNTY.

SO I JUST HOPE THAT'LL HELP UNDERSTAND WHAT WE WERE THINKING AT THE TIME.

COMMISSIONER TAYLOR WAS NEXT. HANG ON. GO AHEAD.

ARE YOU DONE NOW? I JUST REMEMBER THAT THAT A YEAR WAS MENTIONED, LIKE, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WOULD TAKE IT OVER FOR A YEAR OR SOMETHING, AND IT'S BEEN OVER A YEAR. I JUST REMEMBER A YEAR. YES, MA'AM. I THINK WE WOULD HAVE LIKED TO HAVE ACQUIRED IT. I MEAN, I THINK THAT WAS WE WERE WE WERE ASKING STAFF TO GO OUT THERE AND DO WHAT THEY COULD TO ACQUIRE IT. BUT BUT WE HAVE NOT PURCHASED IT.

I'M NOT SURE THAT THERE'S BEEN ANY PURCHASE THAT HAS BEEN POSSIBLE DUE TO THE COMPLICATIONS THAT HAVE THAT WE'VE DISCOVERED.

COMMISSIONER ARNOLD. THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR. YEAH.

TO BUILD UPON WHAT COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST SAID, THE DIRECTION OF THE BOARD AT THE TIME WAS WE WERE TRYING TO FOLLOW WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTED. THE COMMUNITY. AFTER SURVEYS AND TOWN HALLS AND ROUNDTABLES, THEY THEY WANTED THE COUNTY TO TO DRIVE THIS REDEVELOPMENT PROCESS.

BECAUSE IF LEFT TO THE FREE MARKET, WE WILL HAVE DEVELOPERS BEATING DOWN OUR DOOR.

AND I CAN ASSURE YOU, WE HAVE FROM THE MOMENT WE WE EXPRESSED INTEREST IN IN PURCHASING THE PRODUCTION BUILDING UNTIL AS RECENTLY AS YESTERDAY, WE HAVE DEVELOPERS COMING TO US WHO WANT TO ACQUIRE THIS PROPERTY AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR INTENTIONS ARE.

AND UNDER THE CURRENT ZONING, IT CAN BE LIVE, LOCAL AND IT CAN GO TO MY KNOWLEDGE.

PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG TO THE HEIGHT OF THE NEAREST COMPARABLE BUILDING, WHICH IS THE TOWER, WHICH IS THE TALLEST BUILDING IN SAINT JOHN'S COUNTY? CORRECT.

THAT'S THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. IF WE. IF WE LEAVE THIS TO THE OPEN MARKET, I JUST WANT EVERYBODY TO UNDERSTAND THAT THAT'S THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING OF OF WHAT WE'RE PUTTING AT RISK HERE.

SO WE WERE LISTENING TO THE WILL OF THE COMMUNITY.

THE WILL OF THE COMMUNITY WAS FOR THE COUNTY TO DRIVE THE REDEVELOPMENT.

BUT AT THIS POINT, THROUGH THE DUE DILIGENCE PROCESS, I HAVE SERIOUS RESERVATIONS.

IF THEY'RE NOT GOING TO LIFT THE LAND USE RESTRICTION ON THE PRODUCTION BUILDING, AND IF THEY WANT TO BE LET OUT OF WHAT I BELIEVE IS $18 MILLION OF ROAD IMPROVEMENTS.

YEAH, THAT WAS MY QUESTION. YEAH. I DON'T THINK OUR COMMUNITY IS GOING TO STAND FOR THAT.

AND I DON'T THINK WE AS A BOARD SHOULD STAND FOR THAT. THAT BEING SAID, I STILL DO THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT IF WE COULD GET THEM TO AGREE FOR US TO ACQUIRE THAT PRODUCTION BUILDING. IN THE MEANTIME, I THINK THAT THE PROPOSAL PUT FORWARD FOR US FROM SJC, SEE IS IS ONE THAT REALLY ALIGNS WITH WHAT THE COMMUNITY FEEDBACK WANTED A PERFORMING ARTS CENTER, SOMETHING THAT'S VIBRANT SEVEN DAYS A WEEK SINCE WE DIDN'T PURCHASE THE IMAX OR THE HALL OF FAME.

WE INHERITED THEM FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM. WE DO NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT TO DO WITH THEM, AND THIS SEEMS TO FALL IN LINE WITH WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS.

AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, WAS THE FEEDBACK I GOT.

SO THOSE ARE KIND OF MY THOUGHTS. COMMISSIONER MURPHY.

YEAH, I'VE GOT A LOT OF CONFIDENCE IN SCC AND THEIR ABILITY TO TO PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER FOR THE IMAX.

MY CHALLENGE IS THAT WE'RE EVENTUALLY GOING TO HAVE TO COME TO A DECISION ABOUT WHAT TO DO WITH THIS OTHER PROPERTY. ARE WE GOING TO LET THE $18 MILLION GO SO THAT WE CAN DO SOMETHING WITH IT? OR ARE WE GOING TO, YOU KNOW, DIG OUR HEELS IN AND SAY, NO, YOU STILL NEED TO LIVE UP TO YOUR TO YOUR OBLIGATIONS.

[03:50:06]

SO THE IMAX, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, I THINK IT WOULD BE A GREAT USE.

AND, AND I REALLY TRUST THOSE GUYS. I THINK THEY'VE PROVEN THEMSELVES OVER THE YEARS TO BE SOMEBODY WE CAN DEPEND ON TO PUT OUR INTERESTS FORWARD.

SO ANY MORE, I'D LIKE TO SAY SOMETHING. IF YOU'RE DONE.

WELL, I JUST I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER MURPHY. AND THIS IS OUR FIRST P-3 IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY.

AND I THINK WE HAD ALL ENVISIONED WHEN WE DID THIS, THIS ACQUISITION OF THE WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME PROPERTIES THAT WE WERE LOOKING TOWARDS A P3. SO I THINK IT'S A PERFECT FIT. AND THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE EFFORT YOU GUYS PUT IN IT IN SUCH A SHORT AMOUNT OF TIME.

IMPRESSIVE AS ALWAYS. COMMISSIONER TAYLOR, IS YOUR LIGHT ON? OKAY. IN MY OPINION I DO THINK IT'D BE GREAT ON A TEMPORARY BASIS FOR THE IMAX TO BE RUN BY THE THE SJ AMPHITHEATER PEOPLE.

I THINK IT WOULD BE GREAT. BUT I DO THINK EVEN $18 MILLION IS PROBABLY A LOT LESS THAN WE'RE GOING TO SPEND IN THE IN THE FUTURE ON THAT AREA.

IT'S A IT'S A DISASTER. WE NOW THAT WE HAVE BUCKIES AND ALL THE ENTERTAINMENT ACROSS THE ACROSS THE STREET AND THE CONDITION OF THESE BUILDINGS.

I JUST THINK WE'RE GOING TO END UP LOSING A LOT MORE MONEY THAN THAT. AND I'VE BEEN IN REAL ESTATE A LONG TIME, AND I JUST CAN'T SEE THE UPSIDE OF THAT WHOLE THING EXCEPT FOR, YOU KNOW, FOR THE COMMUNITY TO HAVE THE IMAX CONTINUE ON UNTIL WE FIGURE OUT ALL THE TANGLED WEB AND DIVEST OF THIS PROPERTY. THAT'S MY OPINION.

AND ANYTHING ELSE. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

I'M NOT SURE WE HAVE A DIRECTION, BUT. I WAS GOING TO SAY WE HAVE NO DIRECTION STILL.

MADAM CHAIR, I JUST HAVE A I HAVE A I HAVE A THOUGHT.

PARDON ME. WAIT. OH. SHOULD WE HAVE A PUBLIC COMMENT? I WOULD LOVE TO HEAR PUBLIC COMMENT NUMBER ONE. AND THEN NUMBER TWO, I'D LIKE TO JUST FLOAT AN IDEA.

OKAY. DO YOU WANT TO FLOAT THE IDEA BEFORE PUBLIC COMMENT SO THEY CAN COME? I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO GIVE. I KNOW THIS GENTLEMAN'S BEEN WAITING ALL DAY AND I KNOW A LOT OF FOLKS ARE HERE. ALL RIGHT, LET'S DO PUBLIC COMMENT THEM FIRST. OKAY.

WE'LL NOW OPEN THE FLOOR FOR PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER FOUR.

AGAIN, MY NAME IS DAVID UNCAPHER. I LIVE IN WORLD GOLF VILLAGE, AND WE'VE OWNED A PROPERTY THERE FOR ABOUT FOUR YEARS.

I'VE HAD NATIONAL EXPERIENCE THROUGH THE DOT WITH THE PLANNING PROCESSES THAT MAKE AREAS LIVABLE, SUSTAINABLE AND THRIVE. AND YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY WITH THIS PROPERTY THAT IS BEYOND AMAZING TO DRIVE.

WHAT COULD BE DONE THERE? NOT JUST BECAUSE I LIVE THERE, BUT BECAUSE I CAN JUST SEE THAT IT'S JUST LANGUISHED OVER THERE.

AND YOU ALREADY OWN THE CONVENTION CENTER, AND IT APPEARS THESE OTHER TWO PROPERTIES.

AND I FEEL LIKE I LIKE THE IDEAS ABOUT THE PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP, AND I'VE SEEN THOSE DO WELL.

AND THE IDEA TO BRING MORE, MORE OF A MULTI-PURPOSE FAMILY VENUE TO THAT AREA, I THINK WOULD BE THE RESIDENTS WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY WITH THAT OTHER THAN AN IMAX. I MEAN, I THINK THEY DEFAULTED TO AN IMAX SOLUTION BECAUSE IT'S THAT'S WHAT IT IS.

SO I WOULD JUST HIGHLY RECOMMEND, YOU KNOW, FOR ALL OF THAT AREA, YOU OWN THE CONVENTION CENTER, RIGHT? YOU RUN THAT. IT'S YOUR THING. AND TO PROVIDE ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY WITHIN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, THAT IS A PLACE WHERE, YOU KNOW, TOURISTS, BUT ALSO FAMILIES COULD COME AND ENJOY THAT, THAT PROPERTY.

I MEAN, THERE'S A HUGE THERE'S A BEAUTIFUL POND THERE.

THERE'S THE OPPORTUNITY FOR JUST SO MUCH. I LIVED IN A CITY IN INDIANA CALLED CARMEL.

I WOULD BE HAPPY TO CONNECT WITH THEM AND LET THEM LET THEM MAKE A SIDELINE PRESENTATION TO YOU ABOUT THEIR LIVABILITY DESIGN, BUT THEY TOOK IT UPON THEMSELVES RATHER THAN THE FREE MARKET CREATE WILLY NILLY MESS OF DEVELOPMENT.

THEY TOOK IT UPON THEMSELVES AND THEY NOW HAVE A SYMPHONY HALL.

THEY HAVE NO SPACE FOR MARKETS. THEY HAVE AMAZING THINGS THAT THEY HAVE PUT TOGETHER.

THEY'RE REALLY ALL JUST AROUND SIMPLY A THEY HAVE LIKE A RAILS TO TRAILS THAT GOES IN AND OUT OF INDY AND THEY HAVE SOME OTHER THINGS.

BUT YOU KNOW, THERE ARE NATIONAL EXAMPLES OF HOW TO BRING MORE LIVABLE COMMUNITY.

I JUST DON'T I'M NEW AND I APOLOGIZE. I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR JURISDICTION IS, BUT TO BE ABLE TO DRIVE A MORE COMPREHENSIVE LOOK AT THAT AREA AS WELL AS HOW IT FITS WITH THE REST OF REST OF YOUR SAINT JOHNS COUNTY PLANS IS IS JUST AMAZING.

[03:55:09]

THE FACT THAT YOU INHERITED IT. I KNOW THAT'S A LITTLE TOUGH, BUT YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY BEFORE YOU NOW AND I GUARANTEE YOU IF YOU GIVE IT TO DEVELOPERS, YOU WILL GET A MESS. AND THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE THERE WILL BE NOT, WILL NOT BE HAPPY.

I WON'T BE HAPPY. SO ANYWAY, I, I JUST, I THINK PERSONALLY, IT SEEMS TO ME LIKE THERE IS A INITIALLY IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S A COST, BUT I THINK IN THE LONG RUN THIS WOULD PAY FOR ITSELF IN SO MANY WAYS.

SO THANK YOU. THANK YOU. WHEN CAN I GET MISS MAXFIELD'S SLIDE BACK? OKAY, JUST. TAKE YOUR TIME, SIR. JUST HURRY UP.

THIS MAKES. UP. FOR QUALITY.

COUNCILWOMAN SAID. IT WAS PERFECT. I'M SO GLAD.

YOU'RE. OKAY. IT'S LOADED. HE WANTS. HE WANTS SARAH'S PRESENTATION.

DID YOU APOLOGIZE? OH. ARE YOU OKAY? COULD YOU PUT THAT ON THE SLIDE THAT SHOWS THE OVERALL SITE? YEAH. RIGHT THERE. THAT'S GOOD. YEAH. I MEAN, THAT'S BEAUTIFUL. JOE MCINERNEY, 1005 BLACKBERRY LANE.

SO YOU KNOW, AS A AS AN ARCHITECT, TRAINED AS AN ARCHITECT, VISION HAS ALWAYS BEEN A PART OF MY DNA.

AND THIS IS EXCITING. I MEAN, I JUST HAVE TO SAY IT, AND I KNOW THAT WE'VE GOT A LOT OF IMPEDIMENTS, AS YOU SAY, A CHRISTIAN, YOU KNOW, A RAT'S NEST, PERHAPS COMPLICATED, BUT IT STILL DOESN'T DETER ONE FROM FROM HAVING VISION.

I LIKED EARLIER THAT PRIVATE, PRIVATE PUBLIC PARTNERSHIPS WERE MENTIONED.

AND I DO HAVE TO SAY THAT MARRIOTT IS RIGHT. RIGHT THERE, RIGHT THERE.

REALLY WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY AND I WAS LOOKING FOR JERRY. JERRY. HE'S GONE.

OH, OKAY. GOOD. JERRY WHAT CAN WE DO WITH THE REST OF THIS? I MEAN, YOUR PRESENTATION WAS FABULOUS. IT REALLY WAS THE WAY THAT YOU WALKED US THROUGH THAT.

SO, LOOK, I MEAN, THIS IS JUST A WAITING FOR SOMETHING REALLY, REALLY GREAT TO HAPPEN, BUT LET'S NOT FORGET THE MARRIOTT AND JUST PUT IT OUT THERE.

MARRIOTT, IF YOU OWNED ALL OF THIS, WHAT WOULD YOU DO? HOW WOULD YOU INCREASE YOUR DESTINATION? HOW WOULD YOU MAKE THIS AN ARRIVAL POINT FOR PEOPLE COMING FROM OUT OF STATE AND FROM PENN STATE? I MEAN, I THINK THE SKY'S THE SKY'S THE LIMIT.

REALLY? AND MIKE HAD A GOOD VISION ABOUT WALKABLE, LIVABLE COMMUNITIES.

CARMEL. I MEAN, MY GOSH. BUT YOU POINT OUT THAT THE MARKET HAS TRIED AND FAILED AND TRIED AND FAILED.

SO, YOU KNOW WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS. WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THIS REALISTICALLY.

I JUST PUT IT OUT THERE THAT I THINK MARRIOTT CAN GIVE US SOME MORE FOR MORE INFORMATION AND SOME MORE IDEAS.

I MEAN THAT JERRY'S IDEA FOR THIS THEATER IS, IS FANTASTIC.

AND I THINK THAT MARRIOTT COULD, COULD PIGGYBACK ON THAT AND MAKE THAT PART OF THEIR PACKAGING, YOU KNOW, COME AND COME AND BE HERE. WE'VE GOT THE GOLF COURSE STILL HERE.

I WISH THE TRAFFIC WEREN'T THERE. I WISH THERE WERE A QUICKER WAY TO GET HERE THAN DRIVING TWO MILES ALL THE WAY AROUND.

THAT WAS A GREAT WAY TO KIND OF CELEBRATE THE DESTINATION, BUT A QUICKER WAY AND A QUICKER WAY IS POSSIBLE.

I MEAN, I'VE LOOKED AT THE SITE, I'VE LOOKED AT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT A ROAD THAT ENDS AT AN OFFICE, A CLUSTER AND AND CAN BE MADE TO HAPPEN? I REALLY THINK SO.

I JUST PUT IT OUT THERE THAT LET'S NOT GIVE UP ON THIS.

LET'S NOT GIVE UP ON THE BIG VISION HERE. AND PEOPLE LIKE JERRY, PEOPLE LIKE ALL OF YOU COMMISSIONERS, YOU ALL HAVE IDEAS HERE. YOU'VE GOT A GREAT STAFF.

LET'S JUST LET'S JUST MAKE SOMETHING HAPPEN. LET'S DON'T GIVE UP ON THIS.

AND IN TERMS OF OF WHAT OUR LEGAL COUNSEL CAN, CAN GIVE US, I MEAN, ALL OF THE ALL OF THE PEOPLE IN THE ORIGINAL LANGUAGE, THEY'RE ALL GONE. SO THE ONLY THING WE HAVE LEFT IS SOME DESIGNATED USE.

HOW DOES THAT HAPPEN WHEN EVERYONE ELSE IS GONE? SO I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE CAN BE SOME TOUGH, TOUGH STANCE TAKEN BY THE COUNTY.

THIS IS WHAT WE WANT TO HAVE HAPPEN AND LEGALLY WE'RE GOING TO MAKE IT HAPPEN.

SO I JUST PUT IT OUT THERE. LET'S DREAM BIG. THANK YOU, THANK YOU.

HI ALL, I'M GEORGE CLEAR. I'M FROM PALM BEACH GARDENS, FLORIDA.

I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF THE WV COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES.

WE ARE REPRESENTING THE TENANTS AND THE OWNERSHIP INTEREST OF THAT.

[04:00:01]

ALSO IN SPEAKING TO REVEREND BRIAN LAMOUREAUX EARLIER.

REPRESENT THEIR INTERESTS AS WELL. I MEAN, ONE OF THE NARRATIVES, FIRST OF ALL, THAT I WANTED TO POINT OUT IS, IS THAT THE YELLOW BUILDINGS THAT YOU SEE THERE HAVE BEEN CHARACTERIZED AS A FAILURE AND IMPOSSIBLE TO, TO BE A SUCCESS. I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT NOW THAT WE'RE AT 100% LEASED.

WE WE HAVE GREAT TENANTS THAT ARE PROVIDING SERVICES TO THE COMMUNITY.

WE SEE THE, THE OVERALL COMMUNITY WHEN WE ORIGINALLY INVESTED IN HERE AS SOMETHING THAT HAS A POSITIVE FUTURE, AND WE'RE EXPERIENCING THAT RIGHT NOW. SO I, FOR THE BENEFIT OF MY, MY TENANTS AND THE PEOPLE THAT ARE OPERATING IN ADDITION TO MURRAY BROTHERS, I WANT TO POINT THAT OUT. YOU KNOW, WORLD GOLF VILLAGE WAS WAS ANCHORED BY THE HALL OF FAME, AND WE RELIED ON THEM NOT ONLY FOR AS A DRAW, BUT ALSO AS, AS A, AS A VEHICLE TO MAINTAIN THE OVERALL CONDITION OF THE PROPERTY. AND AS THAT, WE ALL HAD TO PAY A PROPORTIONATE SHARE OF THOSE COSTS.

SO ONE OF THE CONCERNS THAT WE HAVE GOING IN TODAY IS LONG TERM.

WE'RE ALL ON BOARD WITH WHATEVER YOU ALL WANT TO DO, BUT SHORT TERM WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT THE INTEREST OF, OF OUR TENANTS AND OUR OWNERSHIP IS PROTECTED AND THE COSTS THAT ARE, THAT ARE ASSOCIATED WITH IT.

SO OBVIOUSLY, WHEN THE HALL OF FAME WAS CLOSED, WE HAD THAT CONCERN.

SO FAR, ALL THE DUES HAVE BEEN PAID AND THERE HAS NOT BEEN A PROBLEM.

BUT NOW IT LOOKS LIKE THAT WITH THE TERMINATION OF THE GROUND LEASE, THAT THERE MAY BE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU GUYS TO NO LONGER BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MAINTENANCE OF THE PROPERTY. I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE COMMISSION MEETINGS I HEARD WHEN THEY WERE DISCUSSING THE VOTE ON BUYING THIS PROPERTY WAS YOU DIDN'T WANT THIS TO BECOME A WHITE ALBATROSS.

AND I THINK THAT THAT WITHOUT DIRECTION. I WOULD JUST HATE TO SEE THIS THING FALL INTO AN ABYSS.

THAT TAKES ALL OF US DOWN WITH IT. THANK YOU.

COULD I ASK YOU A QUESTION? ARE YOU OF ANY INTEREST IN BUYING THE REST OF IT? RIGHT NOW, I'M INTERESTED IN OUR SHORT TERM CONCERNS OF THE COST ASSOCIATED WITH THE MAINTENANCE AND THE UPKEEP OF THE MAINTENANCE.

AS FAR AS LOOKING AT AN OPPORTUNITY FOR A LONG TERM PARTNERSHIP OR ARRANGEMENT, I WOULD CERTAINLY LOOK AT THAT.

I MEAN, WE'VE HAD WE'VE BEEN SUCCESSFUL. IT WASN'T ALWAYS A SUCCESS.

IT TOOK US A LOT OF TIME TO GET TO THE STAGE WE ARE NOW. WE CONGRATULATE REVERB ON THE WORK THEY'VE DONE IN THEIR BUILDING AND AND OUR OTHER TENANTS, BUT IT'S CERTAINLY A DISCUSSION WE CAN HAVE. BUT IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW, IT'S SHORT TERM.

WHO SHOULD HE TALK TO? LEX? WHO SHOULD HE TALK TO? HE CAN SUBMIT PROPOSALS TO THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR.

AND IT FILTERS DOWN TO. HOW ABOUT YOU WANT TO COME IN AND SEE ME? SURE. THANK YOU. I EXPECT I CAN'T WAIT TO SEE YOU.

OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. THANK YOU.

GOOD AFTERNOON. I'M JACK PETER. I LIVE AT 1145 NECK ROAD, PONTE VEDRA BEACH.

INTERESTING CONVERSATION. I RETIRED FROM THE PGA TOUR AFTER A 25 YEAR CAREER WITH THE PGA TOUR, AND SPENT MOST OF THAT TIME INVOLVED WITH THE DEVELOPMENT, BUILDOUT AND MANAGEMENT OF THE PGA TOUR PRODUCTIONS, BUILDING THE WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME AND THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE GENERALLY.

I READ THE STAFF REPORT AND THE RECOMMENDATIONS FROM TPM, AND I WANT TO PROVIDE SOME PERSPECTIVE ON THREE ISSUES THAT I THINK ARE REALLY CRITICAL TO THE REDEVELOPMENT OF THE CORE OF THE VILLAGE. THE FIRST HAS TO DO WITH THE DISPARITY OF THE VARIOUS OWNERSHIP GROUPS THAT MAKE UP THE VILLAGE.

THE SECOND IS THE INGRESS AND EGRESS ISSUES OF THE VILLAGE GENERALLY, AND THE THIRD IS THIRD IS WHAT ROLE THE COUNTY OUGHT TO PLAY IN THIS MESS.

AS TO THE OWNERSHIP, THEY'VE ALREADY POINTED OUT THERE'S PROBABLY SEVEN PRIMARY PLAYERS THE PGA TOUR, WORLD GOLF FOUNDATION, THE RENAISSANCE HOTEL, THE COUNTIES, ONE OF THE OWNERS, TROON GOLF, WHO'S HERE TODAY, AMERICAN COMMERCIAL REALTY, WAS THE ORIGINAL ONE OF THE RETAIL RING DAVIDSON DEVELOPMENT.

BLUEGREEN VACATION VILLAS AND A HANDFUL OF OTHER GROUPS OWN THE WORLD GOLF VILLAGE.

SO BEFORE ANYONE SETTLES ON A PLAN OUT THERE, THERE NEEDS TO BE AN UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THESE BUSINESSES ACTUALLY INTERACT WITH EACH OTHER AND HOW THEY DON'T. ONE OF THE REASONS DISNEY AND UNIVERSAL AND OTHER MAJOR ATTRACTIONS LIKE THAT WORK SO WELL IS THEY ARE GOVERNED BY A SINGLE OWNERSHIP STRUCTURE. SO I WOULD ENCOURAGE THE TEAM THAT'S LOOKING AT THIS SITE TO REALLY START TO THINK OUT OF THE BOX AND EXPLORE OPTIONS RELATIVE TO THE CURRENT OWNERSHIP OWNERSHIP STRUCTURE.

THEY ALL HAVE VERY DIFFERENT AGENDAS. SOMETIMES THEY COMPETE AND SOMETIMES THEY DON'T.

THE SECOND ISSUE IS THE INGRESS AND EGRESS. THAT 1.2 MILE DRIVE THAT'S BEEN ALLUDED TO INTO THE SITE HAS LONG BEEN A MAJOR OBSTACLE FOR

[04:05:01]

BUSINESSES, FOR VISITORS AND FOR TOURISTS. AND THERE'S BASICALLY ONLY TWO SOLUTIONS TO FIX IT.

ONE OF THEM HAS TO DO WITH RECONFIGURING THE EXIT OFF OF I-95, WHICH IS GOING TO INVOLVE THE FEDERAL, THE STATE, THE LOCAL, AND MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.

AND THE SECOND ONE HAS TO DO WITH RECONFIGURING THE SERVICE DRIVE NEXT TO THE PGA TOUR GOLF ACADEMY AND CREATING A WHOLE NEW ARRIVAL EXPERIENCE INTO THE CORE OF THE VILLAGE OF OF OF THE VILLAGE. BUT THAT'S GOING TO ENTAIL EITHER BUYING A PORTION OR ALL OF THE GOLF COURSE.

BIG IDEAS AND BIG SUBJECTS. AND THEN THE COUNTY'S ROLE IS THE LAST PIECE I WANT TO TOUCH ON.

I'M GOING TO GO OVER JUST BY A SECOND, BUT THE COUNTY SHOULD NOT TAKE AN OWNERSHIP IN ANYTHING ELSE OTHER THAN WHAT YOU ALREADY OWN OUT THERE.

WHAT YOU NEED TO DO IS HELP FACILITATE DEVELOPMENT, AS YOU'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT, AND DO IT FROM A REGULATORY AND A LEGISLATIVE STANDPOINT, WHETHER IT'S LAND USE, WHETHER IT'S ZONING, WHETHER IT'S INCENTIVES, TAX BREAKS, THE COUNTY SHOULD DO WHATEVER IT TAKES, BUT STOP SHORT OF OWNING ANYTHING ELSE OUT THERE.

AND WHILE I WILL TELL YOU WHY THE IMAX THEATER IS A WONDERFUL, GREAT AMENITY, IT WILL ALWAYS STRUGGLE AS AN INDEPENDENT BUSINESS.

YOU CANNOT MAKE MONEY SELLING 2030 FOR A SINGLE TICKET AT $15 A HEAD.

IT JUST DOESN'T WORK. SO IN CLOSING, I WANT TO URGE THE TEAM TO WIDEN THEIR LENS AND REALLY START TO LOOK AT THIS FROM 100,000FT.

NONE OF THESE ARE NEW ISSUES. EVEN THE NAME RECOGNITION AND THE INFLUENCE OF THE PGA TOUR AND THE CACHET OF THE WORLD GOLF HALL OF FAME, WE COULDN'T OVERCOME THESE CHALLENGES. THE OWNERSHIP STRUCTURE, THE INGRESS, THE EGRESS AND THE ROLE THE COUNTY PLAYS, IN MY OPINION, ARE STRATEGICALLY MUCH MORE IMPORTANT THAN FOCUSING ON 37 ACRES OF THE CORE OF THE VILLAGE, WHICH PRIMARILY INCLUDES THE PARKING LOT AND A LAKE AND THE TWO BUILDINGS.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

NICOLE CROSBY, 1169 NECK ROAD. I DON'T LIVE IN THE AREA THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, BUT I'VE HEARD A LOT ABOUT IT.

I DO REMEMBER HEARING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, LIKE ANNE SAID, OH, IN ONE YEAR WE'LL KNOW WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN AND WE REALLY AREN'T THERE.

I ALSO RECALL A LOT OF OBJECTIONS TO THE SURVEYS THAT WERE DONE.

THERE WERE PEOPLE THAT BROUGHT UP ISSUES ABOUT THE SURVEYS THAT MADE THEM FEEL THEY WEREN'T REALLY VALID.

SO, I MEAN, THERE HAVE BEEN MAY HAVE BEEN SOME VALID FEEDBACK IN THERE, BUT WHAT I'D LIKE TO SUGGEST, JUST ESPECIALLY BASED ON THE LAST COMMENT WE HEARD, IS PERHAPS SOME KIND OF CITIZEN ADVISORY GROUP.

PERHAPS JACQUES PETER COULD BE INVOLVED IN THAT.

HE CLEARLY HAS A TON OF KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THIS, AND I JUST FEEL LIKE INSTEAD OF JUST LOOKING FOR A QUICK SOLUTION, I MEAN, EVEN THOUGH IT'S A CUTE IDEA TO SEVEN DAYS A WEEK, OF COURSE THAT ALL SOUNDS FUN, BUT IT JUST SEEMS LIKE I THINK THAT A, I THINK WE JUST NEED TO STEP BACK AND LOOK AT THIS THING BIGGER PICTURE AND GET MORE CITIZEN FEEDBACK AT THIS POINT, MORE PROFESSIONAL FEEDBACK FROM PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN INVOLVED.

IT'S OBVIOUSLY EXTREMELY COMPLICATED. I'VE TRIED TO WRAP MY HEAD AROUND IT.

I'M STILL NOT EVEN QUITE UNDERSTANDING ALL THE DIFFERENT ENTITIES INVOLVED, BUT I, I DO HOPE THAT THAT IT JUST GETS STUDIED AND STUDIED AND DISCUSSED FURTHER. I'M ALSO A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT THE NONPROFIT INVOLVEMENT, BECAUSE I'M NOT EVEN CLEAR ON, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S GOING ON WITH PONTE VEDRA CONCERT HALL AND, YOU KNOW, IS THE COUNTY JUST PAYING MONEY AND OR WE'RE NOT SHARING ANY PROFITS.

SO I'M NOT CLEAR ON THAT EITHER. SO I WOULDN'T WANT TO SEE A SITUATION AT WORLD GOLF WHERE THE COUNTY IS PAYING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS A YEAR, NOT GETTING ANY MONEY BACK ON IT. SO I THINK IT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA TO TAKE A STEP BACK AND REALLY LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE OF THIS PLACE.

OKAY. THANK YOU. CHUCK LABANOWSKI, 1748 NORTH CAPITOL. I LIVE RIGHT DOWN THE STREET FROM THIS COMPLEX.

I DON'T THINK WE NEED TO BECOME LANDLORDS BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN IF I UNDERSTAND IT CORRECTLY.

THOSE YELLOW BUILDINGS WE WILL BE BUYING. AM I CORRECT? IF THAT'S THE CASE, WE DON'T NEED TO BECOME LANDLORDS.

NO, IT'S NOT CORRECT. OKAY. BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT'S SHOWING UP IN THE RECORDS.

THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IF WE'RE GOING TO BE LANDLORDS OR NOT.

BUT WE STILL WANT TO BUY ANOTHER BUILDING. IT'S BEEN GREAT IF THAT COULD HAVE BEEN TURNED INTO THE SHERIFF'S COMPLEX.

UNFORTUNATELY, THERE'S ONLY ONE WAY IN AND OUT.

AND AS MR. PETERS SAID, THERE NEEDS TO BE ANOTHER EXIT IF IT'S GOING TO BE WORTHWHILE.

DO WE REALLY NEED TO BUY ALL THIS OR CAN WE CONTROL IT?

[04:10:04]

AND AGAIN, AS MR. PETERS SAID, WE COULD PROBABLY CONTROL THIS BY MAKING SURE THAT WE DO.

RIGHT ON WHAT'S GOING IN THERE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

IS THERE ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? GLAAD, WEST CITY OF SAINT AUGUSTINE? HIM. I DON'T LIVE UP THERE.

BUT YOU GOT THE SAME PROBLEMS UP THERE THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ALL THE TIME. BUT I WANT TO KNOW IF I SEE A32 VOTE, IF THERE'S A VOTING ON THIS THING, WHICH IS FINE, BUT REALLY NOT FINE.

BUT THAT'S THE WAY IT GOES SOMETIMES. I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S OTHER PEOPLE.

MAYBE NOT, BUT DO WE REALLY NEED TO RUSH NOW BECAUSE OF ONLY ONE GROUP? THAT'S A 500 1C3 WANTS TO DO THIS BECAUSE THEY'VE DONE IT AT THE AMP AND OTHER PLACES, TOO.

CAN WE? I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RUSH IS RIGHT NOW.

I DON'T KNOW THE LEGAL MUMBO JUMBO. I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU UNDERSTOOD ALL THAT.

I DIDN'T, BUT THERE SEEMS TO BE A NEED FOR MORE INFORMATION BEFORE ANYTHING IS REALLY DECIDED.

TODAY, I KNOW IT'S JUST THE STAFF PRESENTING IT.

AND THEN I APPRECIATE YOU ALLOWING US TO SPEAK IN PUBLIC AFTER THESE COMMENTS.

AND THAT ONE GENTLEMAN. I FORGOT WHAT HIS NAME WAS.

HE KNEW WHAT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT. HE REALLY DID.

AND I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OF YOU BESIDES CHAIR JOSEPH WOULD LIKE TO GO TALK TO HIM, BUT I'D LIKE TO GO TALK TO HIM MYSELF SO HE CAN EXPLAIN IT TO SOMEONE AS SIMPLE AS ME, WHO HAD AN UNFORTUNATE INCIDENT EARLIER.

AND THERE WILL NOT BE ANOTHER TEN MINUTE BREAK ON MY ACCOUNT.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? THANK YOU. DOUG BURNETT, SAINT JOHN'S LAW GROUP, 104 SEAGROVE MAIN STREET HERE IN SAINT AUGUSTINE, FLORIDA.

I JUST WANT TO AND I'M GLAD YOUR COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE GOT THIS SLIDE PUT BACK UP THERE BECAUSE IT REFLECTS THE CURRENT OWNERSHIP AND WHO OWNS WHAT.

AND WE ALL KNOW THE HALL OF FAME BUILDING, THE BIG BUILDING ON THE LEFT WHERE IMAX IS.

I WANT TO POINT SOMETHING OUT FOR YOU THOUGH. WHEN THE COUNTY AGREED TO EARLY TERMINATE THE LEASE.

YOU KNOW YOU HAVE A LONG TERM LEASE. AND THE WAY THAT WORKS, THE COUNTY OWNS THE DIRT.

THE BUILDER DEVELOPER IS GOING TO LEASE IT FOR A LOW COST, AND THEY BUILD A BUILDING AND THEY HAVE A VERY LONG TERM LEASE BECAUSE THEY'RE GOING TO AMORTIZE THE COST OF BUILDING THE BUILDING OVER THAT PERIOD OF TIME.

WHAT HAPPENED, THOUGH, WAS WHEN YOU TERMINATED THE LEASE, YOU GET THE RESPONSIBILITY OF WHAT YOUR STAFF POINTED OUT WAS $400,000 A YEAR OF MAINTENANCE, AND YOU GET THE ASSESSMENT OF $370,000.

SO YOU UNDERTAKE SOMEWHERE NORTH OF $750,000 A YEAR OF COST IN CONNECTION WITH TERMINATE EARLY TERMINATING THAT LEASE.

AND THAT QUESTION OF DOING THAT UNDERTAKING THAT COST, IT BEGS THE QUESTION OF WHETHER THAT WAS FULLY VETTED BEFORE YOU GOT TO THE POINT YOU ARE NOW. AND NOW YOU HAVE A HALL OF FAME. NOW, IT'S INTERESTING BECAUSE THE HALL OF HALL OF FAME BUILDING, IT DOES HAVE, AND I THINK THIS IS WHERE YOU REALLY WANT TO FOCUS MAYBE IS ON THIS USE RESTRICTION.

IT'S GOT SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE AND IT SAYS THAT GREAT LAWYER LANGUAGE I GUESS, OR OTHER SIMILAR ENTERTAINMENT FACILITY, FACILITY AND ANCILLARY USES THERE TOO. BUT THEN IT SAYS FOR NO OTHER PURPOSE.

WELL, I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY WHAT THAT MEANS AND HOW MUCH YOU CAN PUSH THE ENVELOPE OF THAT USE RESTRICTION, BUT I THINK THAT'S WHAT YOU REALLY WANT TO DRILL DOWN IN WHAT YOUR LEGAL DEPARTMENT FEELS.

THEY'RE CONFIDENT, AND ADMIN FEELS CONFIDENT TO PUSH THE ENVELOPE ON WHAT THOSE USE RESTRICTIONS ARE, BECAUSE THAT'S HOW YOU POTENTIALLY MONETIZE THIS AND FIND A BUYER FOR IT.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO GET RID OF IT AND PUT IT BACK INTO THE PRIVATE SECTOR TO GO OUT FOR AN RFP TO SEE WHO IS ACTUALLY INTERESTED IN ACQUIRING THAT, WHAT THEY WOULD PAY FOR IT, WHAT THEIR INTENDED USE IS, HOW THAT FITS WITH MAYBE YOUR CONSTITUENTS IN THESE SURVEYS THAT YOU'VE DONE FROM THE PUBLIC, BUT THAT MAY BE A WAY FOR YOU TO GET OUT OF THIS AND NOT HAVE TO BEAR THAT COST.

LONGER THAN THE 1 OR 2 YEARS, I'M THINKING WAS THE INITIAL ENVISION OF WE'LL PUT THESE.

ASSETS TOGETHER AND SEE WHAT GOES FROM THERE.

AND LIKE GEORGE POINTED OUT EARLIER, YEAH. EVERYTHING IN YELLOW IS LEASED UP.

IN FACT, THERE'S BEEN SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENTS TO THOSE.

PROPERTIES FROM THE TENANT INVESTMENTS IN THAT IN THOSE PROPERTIES TO BUILD OUT SPACE.

ENTER IN LONGER TERM LEASES. SO YOU DO HAVE THAT DYNAMIC.

OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE OUR CHURCH IS GROWING AND DOING WELL.

SO I JUST FIGURED I'D ADD THAT TO THE MIX. SO YOU'D HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF UNDERSTANDING OF SOME OF THE HISTORY OF WHERE YOU'RE AT TODAY.

[04:15:06]

THANK YOU SIR. ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? SUZANNE CLEWLOW 109 LAUREL WOOD WAY 32086. THIS HAS BEEN AN INTERESTING IN CONVERSATION.

I THINK THAT THE GENTLEMAN THAT GAVE THE EXIT THREE, TWO, THREE CONCEPT INFORMATION, HE WAS GREAT. WHERE HAS HE BEEN HIDING? AND THE FIVE THAT THEY ALREADY ARE DOING, THEY'RE ALL SUCCESSES.

I MEAN, COME ON. JACK, PETER HAD GOOD INPUT. DOUG BURNETT THAT WAS REALLY GOOD.

I THINK WE'VE GOT SOME GOOD, SOLID INFORMATION TO GO FORWARD WITH.

IT'S NOT READY FOR PRIME TIME YET, BUT I DON'T LIVE ANYWHERE NEAR THIS.

BUT BACK IN THE DAY, WHEN I MOVED HERE 30 YEARS AGO IT WAS EASY TO GET UP THERE.

HOP ON 95. BOOM, BOOM. YOU'RE THERE. GO A MILE AND A HALF OR WHATEVER BACK IN THERE.

I THINK MY LATE HUSBAND EVEN HAS A BRICK OUT IN FRONT IN THAT AREA WHERE THEY ASK PEOPLE TO CONTRIBUTE.

WE WOULD GO TO THE FIREWORKS. WE DID A LOT OF THINGS UP THERE.

I THINK THAT THIS CONCEPT THAT HE HAS FOR THE IMAX IS A GOOD CONCEPT, AND IT NEEDS TO BE COMMUNICATED TO THE COMMUNITY UP THERE TO SEE WHAT THEY THINK.

I'D HEARD THINGS LIKE WE WERE GOING TO MOVE SOME COUNTY OFFICES UP THERE.

BUILDINGS ARE THERE. I'VE HEARD A LIBRARY, MAYBE.

I THINK THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT COULD GO IN THERE.

AND IF YOU'RE GOING TO A CULTURAL EVENT, IF YOU'RE DRIVING AT, WHAT, FIVE MINUTES MORE OFF THE MAIN ROAD TO GET TO WHERE YOU'RE GOING, PEOPLE SIT AROUND FOR TWO AND THREE HOURS TO EAT HERE, WHICH I DON'T UNDERSTAND, BUT THEY DO.

I THINK IT'S SOMETHING WE DEFINITELY SHOULD PURSUE.

THE 18 MILLION THAT WE WOULD BE FORGOING. FROM WHAT I HEARD TODAY, THERE'S BEEN LOTS OF IMPACT FEES THAT HAVE GONE BY THE WAYSIDE. ADD IT TO THE PILE.

I MEAN, THAT PROPERTY IS WELL WORTH WHAT YOU'D BE GIVING UP.

AND I CAN GUARANTEE YOU, IF THAT GOES ON THE MARKET, THOSE HIGH RISE MULTI-FAMILY WILL BE THERE UNDER THE WONDERFUL LIVE LOCAL ACT BECAUSE IT FITS THE PROFILE.

I WOULD LIKE TO SEE FURTHER DISCUSSIONS AND AN OPPORTUNITY FOR MORE COMMUNITY INPUT, NOT JUST ON A SURVEY THING. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? SEEING NONE, WE'LL CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT AND I WOULD HAVE BACK TO THE BOARD.

I WOULD HAVE JUST ONE COMMISSIONER MURPHY, ONE RECOMMENDATION, IF YOU DON'T MIND, MADAM CHAIR.

THE QUESTION WAS ASKED, WHAT'S THE RUSH? AND I KIND OF AGREE WITH THAT.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, AND, YOU KNOW, I HATE BEATING A DEAD HORSE, BUT WE REALLY DON'T.

WE REALLY NEED SOME SERIOUS ANSWERS HERE. AND I WOULD PROPOSE TO GET A REPRESENTATIVE OF EVERY DEPARTMENT WE COULD AND MAYBE ASK MR. PETERS AND MAYBE. MAYBE MR. BARNETT, TOO, FOR STEPPING UP THERE AND OPENING HIS MOUTH TO TO JOIN A GROUP IF WE WOULD, YOU KNOW, PUT A GROUP TOGETHER AND MEET OVER THE NEXT 30 DAYS AND COME BACK TO THE BOARD WITH A WITH A SUGGESTION AND A DIRECTION TO GO WITH SOME WITH SOME HELP. I KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT MORE EXPERTISE OUT HERE IN THE AUDIENCE THAN THERE IS SITTING ON THE DAIS, AND I'D LOVE TO BE ABLE AN OPPORTUNITY TO SIT DOWN WITH A MEMBER OF MY STAFF AND ENJOY YOUR STAFF, AND MAYBE WITH A COUPLE OF PEOPLE FROM THE CITIZENRY TO HELP US KIND OF FIGURE THIS OUT.

COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST. THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.

I THINK THAT'S KIND OF IT'S KIND OF WHERE I WAS HEADED, BUT MAYBE MORE BROADLY.

FIRST OF ALL, I WANTED TO TELL THE GENTLEMAN FROM CARMEL THAT I'VE SORT OF IMMERSED MYSELF IN THE WORLD OF TRANSPORTATION INFRASTRUCTURE THESE LAST FOUR YEARS.

AND I KNOW CARMEL IS THE HOME TO ABOUT 150 ROUNDABOUTS.

THERE'S ONLY 1 OR 2 STOPLIGHTS, BUT YOU GUYS ARE YOU'VE MADE ROUNDABOUTS GREAT AGAIN.

AND I KNOW CARMEL IS INCREDIBLE. IT'S AN INCREDIBLE OVERLAY DISTRICT.

[04:20:01]

THE THE LAND DEVELOPMENT CODE UP THERE IS UNIQUE AND IT'S A BEAUTIFUL COMMUNITY.

BUT WHAT CARMEL HAS TO SUPPORT MANY OF THE FEATURES IS THEY HAVE HOUSING DENSITY.

I MEAN, THEY HAVE A WALKABLE COMMUNITY BECAUSE THERE IS DENSITY.

AND I THINK JUST BASED ON SOME OF THE CONVERSATIONS, AS YOU'RE GETTING TO KNOW SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, BECAUSE YOU'VE OFFERED UP THAT YOU'RE A LITTLE BIT NEW, FOLKS HERE ARE NOT A BIG FAN OF HOUSING DENSITY.

THAT'S STILL KIND OF AN ONGOING CONVERSATION.

SO I KNOW I WOULD LOVE TO MEET WITH YOU AND TALK MORE ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE SEEN AND WHAT YOU KNOW, JUST SO I CAN PICK YOUR BRAIN A LITTLE BIT. BUT JUST I APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS ABOUT CARMEL, BECAUSE I'VE STUDIED THAT A LITTLE BIT. TO THE GENTLEMAN WHO TOLD ME THAT YOU GUYS HAVE 100% LEASING.

CONGRATULATIONS. I CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, MY COMMENTS, THEY MAY HAVE BEEN A LITTLE BIT FLIPPANT, BUT I DIDN'T MEAN TO DISPARAGE THE GOOD WORK THAT YOU ALL ARE DOING BACK THERE.

YEAH, IT IS PRETTY FULL WITH TENANTS. SO AGAIN, CONGRATULATIONS.

CERTAINLY DIDN'T MEAN TO GIVE THE WRONG IMPRESSION, SO I APPRECIATE YOU CORRECTING THE RECORD. LAST THING IS THIS WITH THE IMAX THEATER AGAIN, WHAT JERRY WILSON LAID OUT, I THINK, IS THE FRAMEWORK FOR A CONCEPT THAT I'D LIKE TO SEE MORE INFORMATION ABOUT AND KIND OF GET MORE INTO THE DETAILS.

I'D LIKE TO SEE IF WE COULD GET CONSENSUS AND IT MIGHT BE TOO EARLY.

THIS IS THE ONLY TIME I CAN TALK TO YOU ALL, SO I'M JUST OFFERING THIS AS A SUGGESTION. IF WE COULD GET MORE DETAILS ABOUT THAT.

SO WE CAN KIND OF SEE IF THAT'S SOMETHING WE MIGHT WANT TO MOVE FORWARD ON. I'D LIKE TO SEE US GIVE DIRECTION TO THEM TO FOR THAT ONE PROPERTY, TO PUT TOGETHER A MORE DETAILED PRESENTATION SO WE CAN SEE WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE TO MOVE FORWARD ON THAT.

AS FOR THE REST OF THE PROPERTY, THE COUNTY DID A TOWN HALL AT THE IMAX THEATER.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS A YEAR AGO OR TWO YEARS AGO.

TIMES KIND OF BLEEDING TOGETHER. BUT I'VE SAID FROM THE OUTSET THAT I'D RATHER CUT MEASURE TWICE AND CUT ONCE.

WELL, NOW I'M NOW OF THE MINDSET THAT WE MAY NEED TO MEASURE 4 OR 5 TIMES, BUT IT'S WORTH GETTING IT RIGHT.

IT'S WORTH SLOWING DOWN. SO IF THAT MEANS DOING ANOTHER TOWN HALL AT THE IMAX, WHERE WE HAD ABOUT 200 RESIDENTS FROM THE AREA TURN OUT, AND WE HAD A GREAT PRESENTATION FROM OUR STAFF, I THINK WE HAD SEVERAL COMMISSIONERS THERE WHO GOT TO HEAR IN REAL TIME WHAT THE WHAT THE FEEDBACK WAS FROM THE COMMUNITY WITH THE WITH THE NEW KNOWLEDGE OF WHAT WE'VE DISCOVERED SINCE WE GAVE THE INITIAL BOARD DIRECTION, BUT ALSO WITH THE KNOWLEDGE THAT THIS. I GUESS I KNEW IT PRIOR TO YOU SAYING IT, COMMISSIONER ARNOLD, BUT THIS COULD VERY WELL BE LIVE LOCAL ACT. I REALLY HADN'T PUT THOSE PIECES TOGETHER UNTIL YOU SAID IT.

SO I THINK WE NEED A NEW PRESENTATION, NEW TOWN HALL IN THE IMAX THEATER TO INVITE THE COMMUNITY TO SO WE CAN REALLY TELL THEM WHAT WE'VE LEARNED AND GET SOME MORE FEEDBACK. COMMISSIONER ARNOLD. THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.

TO BUILD ON WHAT COMMISSIONER MURPHY SAID. I'VE SPOKEN WITH MISS ANDREWS PRIOR TO THIS MEETING, AND I BELIEVE THERE ARE SOME ROUNDTABLES THAT ARE BEING SET UP TO KIND OF DISCUSS THIS ALREADY. SO THAT'S A THAT'S A GREAT IDEA.

AND I ALSO AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST.

AND MOVING FORWARD TO GET MORE INFORMATION WITH WHAT WE CAN BRING TO THE TABLE.

I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'RE IN A RUSH, PER SE, BUT WE DO HAVE VERY SIGNIFICANT CARRYING COSTS, AND I THINK THAT COULD HELP OFFSET IT. THE COMMUNITY IS CLAMORING FOR CLAMORING FOR SOMETHING JUST LIKE THAT.

I KNOW YOU LIVE NEAR THERE, MR. TAYLOR. I DO TOO, AND WE'RE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR SOMETHING TO DO.

AND I THINK THAT IT REALLY SPANS ALL THE DIFFERENT DEMOGRAPHICS AND AGE GROUPS THAT ARE OUT THERE.

ONE POINT OF CLARIFICATION I WANT TO MAKE OR ASK OUR LEGAL TEAM IS THE LAND USE RESTRICTIONS DON'T JUST APPLY TO THE PRODUCTION BUILDING THAT WE WERE LOOKING TO PURCHASE.

CORRECT? IT'S ALSO ENCUMBERING WHAT WE INHERITED THE HALL OF FAME AND THE IMAX.

CORRECT. THE LAND USE RESTRICTIONS AFFECT THE PRODUCTION BUILDING, THE HALL OF FAME, THE GOLF COURSE, AND I THINK THE CONVENTION CENTER AS WELL. AND THE HOTEL PROPERTY.

OKAY. SO JUST TO THE BOARD, THAT IS THAT IS A WEB.

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO UNTANGLE ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

SO MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE IN ADDITION TO GETTING MORE INFORMATION ABOUT SGC, IS TO INSTRUCT STAFF TO CONTINUE NEGOTIATIONS JUST TO SEE WHERE WE LAND, TO SEE IF WE IF WE CAN GET THE DEVELOPER TO COME TO SOME SORT OF AGREEMENT WHERE THEY LIFT THE LAND USE RESTRICTIONS, EVEN IF IT'S NOT FOR THE PRODUCTION BUILDING, BUT AT LEAST FOR WHAT THE COUNTY CURRENTLY OWNS.

AND I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT DONE WITHOUT LETTING THE DEVELOPER OFF THE HOOK FOR $18 MILLION OF ROAD IMPROVEMENTS.

THAT IS JUST UNACCEPTABLE, IN MY OPINION, TO OUR RESIDENTS.

SO THAT'S WHERE MY HEAD'S AT. THAT WOULD BE THE DIRECTION THAT I WOULD SUGGEST US MOVING IN.

COMMISSIONER TAYLOR. YEAH, I AGREE, WE DEFINITELY CANNOT LET THEM OUT OF THAT 18 MILLION.

THAT'S WAY TOO MUCH MONEY, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE CONGESTION IN THAT AREA.

BUT I LOVE MR. WILSON'S PRESENTATION. I MEAN, JUST AS SOMEONE THAT HAS ATTENDED A NUMBER OF THE MEETINGS AND HEARD A LOT FROM THE COMMUNITY, IT IS EXACTLY KIND OF, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR.

SO I REALLY I DO LIKE THAT IDEA. I DO LOVE TO THAT.

I THINK THERE WERE A COUPLE NIGHTS INVOLVED WITH SOME TEENS AND, AND THAT AGE AND TEENAGERS ARE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR, FOR SOMETHING TO DO. SO I REALLY LIKE THAT IDEA TOO, BUT I LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE.

[04:25:01]

I WOULD LIKE A LITTLE MORE INFORMATION TOO. I'D LOVE TO LOVE TO KNOW, YOU KNOW, THE COST INVOLVED, WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST TO THE COUNTY AS FAR AS YOU KNOW, WITH THE PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP, JUST JUST A LITTLE MORE CONCRETE INFORMATION OR OR A BETTER GUESSTIMATE YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS WHAT THE COST WOULD BE AND, AND THAT THAT WOULD BE VERY HELPFUL. ALL RIGHT.

SO WE HAVE CONSENSUS TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE IMAX INFORMATION.

MORE DETAILS. GOOD. ALL RIGHT. SO THAT'S ONE DIRECTION.

AND THEN I DO LIKE THE COMBINATION OF COMMISSIONER ARNOLD AND COMMISSIONER MURPHY'S ROUNDTABLE PLEASE, INCLUDING THESE TWO GENTLEMEN THAT BROUGHT NEW INFORMATION IN.

AND I DON'T THINK WE'RE READY FOR A TOWN HALL.

I THINK WE KNOW WHERE WHAT THEY WANT. AS MUCH AS WE JUST NEED TO UNRAVEL THIS WHOLE THING BEFORE WE START PRESENTING AGAIN FOR IDEAS.

BECAUSE YOU CAN HAVE MILLIONS OF IDEAS FOR THIS, LIKE HARRY POTTER WORLD OR SOMETHING THAT'S GOING TO BRING YOU BACK THERE.

AND IT'S GREAT. BUT LET'S REALLY BE REAL HERE.

AND LET'S START WITH THE TWO THINGS THAT WE CAN WE KNOW WE CAN CONTROL, DON'T YOU THINK? IS THAT GOOD, EVERYONE? OKAY. ALL RIGHT. WE HAVE CONSENSUS.

WE HAVE DIRECTION. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU'RE WELCOME.

OH, WAIT. SORRY. CAN I MAKE ONE QUICK COMMENT? WE'LL BE OKAY. OH, YES. FIRST OFF. I APPRECIATE THE FEEDBACK.

WE WORKED PRETTY HARD ON THAT TO JUST COME UP WITH A CLEVER IDEA TO USE THE EXISTING BUILDING.

AND SO A COUPLE OF QUICK JUST CLOSING REMARKS.

WE DIDN'T COME SEARCHING FOR THIS. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE WERE ASKED TO DO AS A PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP.

AND THAT'S THE CORE OF WHAT WE THINK WE ARE. THERE WAS A COMMENT ABOUT THE PONTE VEDRA CONCERT HALL.

MORE THAN WILLING TO TALK ABOUT THAT ANYTIME YOU WANT TO.

THE MAJORITY OF THAT BEGAN BECAUSE OF A SHUTTERED VENUE OPERATORS GRANT, AS WE ALL KNOW, THAT INDIRECTLY STARTED THAT WHOLE THAT WHOLE PROJECT.

SO I'M EXCITED THAT THAT WILL REOPEN MIDDLE OF THE YEAR AND WIND UP BEING ONE OF THE MOST, I THINK, VALUABLE ASSETS THAT THE SAINT JOHNS COUNTY OWNS BECAUSE IT WILL BE A WORLD CLASS CONCERT HALL.

FINALLY, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO WORK WITH STAFF. WE'LL WORK WITH STAFF, AND WE HAVE SOME OF THE NUMBERS PRETTY CLOSE.

I CAN PROMISE YOU THAT THIS IS NOT A MULTI-MILLION DOLLAR CONVERSATION THAT I CAN TELL YOU, AND WE ARE ALL ABOUT. IF WE CAN BREAK EVEN ON IT, WE'LL DO IT.

SO WE'RE HONORED THAT YOU THINK IT'S A GOOD IDEA.

WE APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH STAFF, AND CERTAINLY WE'LL WE'LL BRING THAT TOGETHER.

SO YOU'VE GOT MORE DETAILS. THANK YOU. FINALLY, I WOULD SAY THIS.

IT'S AN INTERESTING IDEA. LIKE WHEN THE SAINT JOHNS COUNTY GOT INTO THE MUSIC BUSINESS, IT BECAME AN INCUBATOR FOR YEARS THAT NOW IS IN A PRIVATE COMPANY. AND ALL OF THAT MANAGEMENT AND ALL OF THAT, YOU KNOW, FRICTION OF 15,000 TRANSACTIONS IN THE COUNTY IS NOW IN A PRIVATE COMPANY AND NOT BEING VERY OBSTINATE WITHIN GOVERNMENTAL OPERATIONS.

SO THIS COULD ALSO BECOME A PILOT IF IT OPENS UP AND IT PROVES TO BE SUCCESSFUL.

IF A BIGGER PLAN COMES OUT OF THIS DIALOG, AND POTENTIALLY A PERFORMING ARTS CENTER COULD BE PART OF THAT, THEN THIS COULD BE, YOU KNOW, A GREAT LEARNING PLATFORM TO, TO BUILD FROM.

AND WE OF COURSE, WE SHARE ALL OF THAT. SO THOSE ARE JUST SOME THOUGHTS. THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING.

THANK YOU SARAH. ALL RIGHT, SAN JUAN DRIVE. MR. HOLDEN.

[4. Public Hearing * San Juan Drive Parking Ordinance Adoption Hearing. This is the second reading and adoption hearing of a proposed amendment to the Ponte Veda Zoning District Regulations (PVZDR) Ordinance No. 2003-05, as amended; Amending Section IX.D,” off-street parking- General provisions” to modify San Juan Drive Parking Requirements and limitations. The first reading of the proposed ordinance was held at the 10/15/24 Board of County Commissioner meeting.]

AFTERNOON, MADAM. MADAM CHAIR. COMMISSIONERS. I'M AL HOLLAND.

I LIVE AT 551 LEMASTER DRIVE IN PONTE VEDRA BEACH.

I'M CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF THE PONTE VEDRA BEACH MUNICIPAL SERVICE DISTRICT.

AND I'M HERE BEFORE THE BEFORE THE BOARD TO ASK YOU TO SUPPORT A PROPOSED ORDINANCE THAT LIMITS PARKING ON SAN JUAN DRIVE. LET ME GET THE NEXT SLIDE.

SAN JUAN, SAN JUAN DRIVE. SAN JUAN DRIVE IS A TWO LANE.

IT'S A TWO LANE IN THE IN THE MSD. IT KIND OF PARALLELS A1A IT GOES FROM SOLANA ROAD TO THE SOUTH UP TO PONTE VEDRA BOULEVARD, THE NORTH, CLOSE TO THE DUVAL COUNTY LINE. THE ROAD VARIES IN WIDTH FROM 19FT TO MAYBE 21 OR 22. IT KIND OF MEANDERS, AVERAGE ABOUT 20FT. YOU GOT PROBABLY 150 HOMES ON ON BOTH SIDES OF THE, OF THE STREET. AND IT, IT RUNS, TWO MILES AND THE POSTED SPEED LIMIT IS 25.

[04:30:03]

HERE ARE THE ISSUES ISSUES WITH THIS PARTICULAR STREET.

AT PRESENT, PARKED VEHICLES, WHETHER ITS CONSTRUCTION OR ITS LANDSCAPING, THEY GENERALLY IMPEDE VEHICULAR TRAFFIC, PEDESTRIANS AND BICYCLISTS.

FOR EXAMPLE, IF YOU'RE IF YOU'RE DRIVING DRIVING NORTH AND THERE'S A TRUCK PARKED, A VEHICLE PARKED ON ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, A PEDESTRIAN, IT'S HARD TO SEE THE PEDESTRIAN COMING, COMING SOUTH.

AND SO THEREFORE, THE PEDESTRIANS SOMETIMES COME AROUND AND THE VEHICLE GETS RIGHT ON TOP OF THEM, AND IT IS REALLY UNSAFE. ALSO, SOME PEOPLE TEND TO SPEED UP TO GET AROUND THESE THESE PARKED VEHICLES TRY TO MAKE UP LOST TIME. SAN JUAN DRIVE IS A CUT THROUGH. WE HAVE FOUR CUT THRUS IN THE MSD, SAN JUAN DRIVE, LA MASTER DRIVE WHERE I LIVE. IT RUNS NORTH SOUTH AND SOLANA ROAD AND CORONA ROAD BECAUSE, AS THE BOARD KNOWS, A-1-A NORTH OF SOLANA IS OVERCAPACITY.

SO PEOPLE TEND TO USE THESE SIDE STREETS TO AVOID THE TRAFFIC CONGESTION.

SO YOU GOT WE GOT BICYCLISTS, PEDESTRIANS AND VEHICLES.

THEY ALL SHARE THIS ROAD. THERE'S NO DEDICATED LANES FOR SIDEWALKS OR ANY STRIPING.

WHAT WE'RE REQUESTING. REQUESTING THE BOARD TO DO IS TO ENACT AN ORDINANCE WHICH WOULD LIMIT PARKING ON SAN JUAN DRIVE MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY BETWEEN THE HOURS OF 7 A.M.

TO 5 P.M.. THE BOARD, THE MSD BOARD, WE VOTED TO APPROVE THAT PARTICULAR ORDINANCE, THAT REQUEST, AND THERE IS A MEETING WITH ONE OF THE RESIDENTS WHO HAS SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THE LIMITS.

AND SO THEREFORE, THE BOARD, WE AGREED TO COMPROMISE.

WE AGREED TO COMPROMISE AND JUST LIMIT THE NO PARKING TO MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY BETWEEN 7 A.M.

AND 5 P.M.. THAT'S THE THAT'S THE BIGGEST USE, THAT'S THE MOST DENSE USE OF SAN JUAN DRIVE AND NOT HAVE THAT RESTRICTION AFTER FIVE DURING THE WEEK OR ON THE WEEKENDS.

AND THAT SEEMED TO SATISFY THE RESIDENTS. WE HAVE THE THE NOW OF COURSE, WE'LL HAVE SOME EXCEPTIONS TO IT.

THE BOARD VOTED TO ENACT AN ORDINANCE FOR A PART OF THE BOULEVARD BACK IN 21.

IT'S WORKED VERY WELL. IT'S A NO PARKING ON THE BOULEVARD.

THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, THEY'RE VERY SATISFIED WITH IT.

I OVERSEE OUR WORK WITH THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT FOR THE MSD, AND WE EMPHASIZE ENFORCEMENT OF TRAFFIC LAWS AND PARKING. SO THEREFORE, MOST OF THE CITATIONS OR WARNINGS ARE FOR SPEEDING, RUNNING STOP SIGNS AND PARKING.

THAT'S CONSTRUCTION, LANDSCAPING, WHATEVER. WE TRY TO KEEP THE ROADS CLEAR.

AS SOON AS THE ROADS ARE KIND OF NARROW AND WITHOUT SIDEWALKS, YOU GOT ALL THESE PEDESTRIANS WALKING, AND I'VE GOT MOTHERS PUSHING BABY STROLLERS. AND WE'RE ALL CONCERNED ABOUT THAT.

THIS IS BASICALLY THE THE LANGUAGE THE LANGUAGE IS PROPOSED ORDINANCE.

AND TO BREAK IT DOWN WE HAVE THE WE HAVE THE SAME EXCEPTIONS FOR AS WE DO FOR BOULEVARD EMERGENCY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT DELIVERY.

THE SCHOOL BUSSES, UPS, FEDEX, WHATEVER THEY THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS FOR THOSE FOR THOSE FOLKS AND FOR THE RESIDENTS AFTER AFTER 5 P.M. DURING DURING THE WEEK.

SO WE HAVE CONDUCTED ALTHOUGH THE BOARD VOTED ON IT.

WE WENT AHEAD AND SAID, OKAY, WE'LL TRY TO SOLICIT THE OPINION OF THE RESIDENTS.

AND SO WE HAD A SURVEY. WE HAVE 1000, I THINK, 42 EMAIL ADDRESSES ON OUR EMAIL

[04:35:01]

LIST. SO WE SENT OUT AN EMAIL BLAST FOR A SURVEY.

VERY SIMPLE QUESTION. ARE YOU IN FAVOR OF NO PARKING ON SAN JUAN DRIVE? AND ON THE RESPONSES WE'VE GOT 72.8%.

72.8% IN FAVOR, 23.2% OPPOSED, AND 4% NO OPINION.

AND OF THOSE, WE SENT OUT THE EMAIL BLAST THREE DIFFERENT TIMES.

SO PEOPLE HAVE PLENTY OF TIME TO TO RESPOND. THERE WERE A TOTAL OF 200 224 RESPONSES.

SO THREE EMAIL BLASTS. I EVEN HAD THEM BREAK IT DOWN TO SAY, OKAY, THE 72% THAT'S EVERYBODY IN THE MSD WERE THEY WERE SENT THAT A FURTHER ONE HAD IT BROKEN DOWN.

THE RESIDENTS ON SAN JUAN DRIVE, BECAUSE WE SENT THE SURVEY OUT, WE ASKED THEM TO WRITE DOWN THEIR ADDRESS.

AND SO THAT PEOPLE OUTSIDE THE MSD WEREN'T TRYING TO INFLUENCE THE VOTE.

SO ON SAN JUAN DRIVE, IT WAS 63.3% IN FAVOR, 35.5% OPPOSED.

ONE PERSON HAD NO OPINION. THAT'S 0.01%. WHATEVER THAT IS.

SO. WE BELIEVE THIS IS A SAFETY ISSUE WHEN WE HAVE PEDESTRIANS WITH THE MOTHER PUSHING A BABY STROLLER OR SOMEBODY WALKING THE DOG. THESE VEHICLES PARKED THERE OBSCURED THESE THESE VEHICLES.

THEY DO IMPEDE TRAFFIC. IT IS A CUT THROUGH, AND THERE'S A LOT OF A LOT OF TRAFFIC ON THAT ROAD.

AND SO THEREFORE THIS IS A SAFETY ISSUE. AND WE BELIEVE THAT WE BELIEVE THAT THIS BAN SHOULD GO IN EFFECT. WE'VE HAD SEVERAL MEETINGS.

THIS HAS BEEN ON THE BEEN ON THE AGENDA QUITE A BIT.

AND FOLKS HERE TODAY SOME SOME IN FAVOR, SOME AGAINST.

I UNDERSTAND ALL THAT. I CAN'T BRING YOU ALL THESE ALL THESE PROGRAMS OR PROJECTS WITH UNANIMITY.

BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT A SUBSTANTIAL, A SUBSTANTIAL MAJORITY OF THE RESIDENTS ARE IN FAVOR OF THE NO PARKING BAN.

NOW, WHAT WE WOULD PROPOSE TO DO IS PUT THE NO PARKING SIGNS SCIENCE LIKE WE DID ON THE BOULEVARD.

WE HAD WE ONLY HAVE TWO SIGNS UP, BASICALLY. SACHSE THE ORDINANCE ABOUT NO PARKING ON SOUTH, ONE ON THE NORTH RATHER THAN. WE'RE NOT OUT TO CLUTTER UP THE STREET WITH ALL THESE NO PARKING SIGNS.

AND SO THAT'S WHAT WE WOULD DO. MISS ANDREWS WAS VERY NICE TO ALREADY.

IMPOSE A TEMPORARY NO PARKING BAN UP ALONG THE SEVENTH.

THE SEVENTH HOLE. THE. ON THE FAIRWAY ON THE WEST SIDE OF THE OF SAN JUAN DRIVE.

THAT WAS DONE AT THE REQUEST OF THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT TO BAN PARKING ALONG THAT STREET, ALONG THAT STRIP THERE, BY THAT FENCE, BY THE GOLF COURSE.

SO WE'VE DONE THAT. AND ANYWAY, IF YOU ALL HAVE ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS, I'D BE GLAD TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

COMMISSIONER WHITEHURST, THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR.

IS THE MECHANISM FOR ENFORCEMENT JUST THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT. CORRECT.

OKAY. THANK YOU. SIR. I ALSO HAVE A QUESTION.

IS THAT THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT THAT THE MSD HAS OR PAYS OR ARE REGULAR DEPARTMENT WOULD BE BOTH.

IT WOULD BE BOTH. WE HAVE THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT.

WE HAVE A REGULAR DEPUTY DEPUTY TEDDER. HE'S THERE ON A REGULAR BASIS.

WE ALSO HAVE I HAVE A DEPUTY THAT TYPICALLY IS THERE FROM 7 A.M.

TO 10:00 AT NIGHT. AND THEY. SO THEY'RE PATROLLING LOOKING FOR THAT.

IS GREG CALDWELL AVAILABLE OR HE'S MAYBE MIKE.

OH, GREG, COULD YOU COME ON UP? THE OTHER QUESTION I HAD WAS WITH THE INN AND CLUB AND THEIR HUGE EXPANSION.

IS THAT AN ISSUE WITH THE CONSTRUCTION WORKERS FLYING THROUGH THERE AT ALL OR.

WELL, IT'S IT'S GOING TO BE. IT WILL BE. IT WILL BE AN ISSUE.

THERE'LL BE THERE'LL BE PARK IN THERE. THERE'LL BE A LOT OF CONSTRUCTION GOING ON.

AND AND THAT'S JUST ANOTHER, ANOTHER ISSUE. WHY WE WHY WE NEED IT.

AND GREG, DOES THIS MAKE THE STREETS SAFER. AND WOULD YOU PUT A YELLOW LINE DOWN THE MIDDLE OR LIKE THEY DO ON THE BOULEVARD? GREG CALDWELL, PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR RIGHT NOW, WE DO NOT HAVE A PLAN TO DO ANY ADDITIONAL STRIPING OUT THERE, BUT MOST LIKELY USUALLY LOCAL ROADS LIKE THIS WOULD NOT HAVE THAT ADDITIONAL STRIPING DOWN THE CENTER OF IT.

[04:40:06]

WE DO FEEL LIKE THIS COULD SOFTEN UP THE ROADWAY, BECAUSE I HEAR MR. HOLLAND TALK ABOUT THE USE, AND A LOT OF THE PEOPLE THAT USE THIS ROAD, REDUCING THE NO PARKING OR REDUCING THE PARKING ALONG THE ROADWAY COULD ENHANCE THE SAFETY. OKAY. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD? ALL RIGHT. LET'S OPEN FOR PUBLIC COMMENT. OKAY.

WE'LL NOW OPEN THE THE FLOOR FOR PUBLIC COMMENT ON AGENDA ITEM NUMBER FOUR.

YES. COME ON. COME RIGHT ON UP. OKAY. THANK YOU GUYS.

NAME AND ADDRESS. MY NAME IS WES MOORE. I LIVE AT 338 SAN JUAN DRIVE.

I'VE LIVED THERE FOR 13 YEARS. I'VE LIVED IN THE MSD FOR 21 YEARS.

I COULD WE COULD FILL UP THIS ROOM WITH THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT WOULD BE IN SUPPORT OF THIS.

BUT THE SURVEYS SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES. I WILL SHARE WITH YOU GUYS TWO OTHER SURVEYS THAT WERE HELD.

ONE WAS IN 2020 AND ONE WAS IN 2021. BY THE COMMUNITY ASSOCIATION.

THE THE COMMUNITY ASSOCIATION HAS A MEMBER. EXCUSE ME.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU GUYS ARE FAMILIAR WITH THE COMMUNITY ASSOCIATION. IT'S A PAID ORGANIZATION.

YOU PAY TO BECOME A MEMBER? IT'S VOLUNTARY. IT'S MAINLY TO ATTEND EVENTS FOR MEMBERS.

SOCIAL EVENTS. SO WHEN WE SOLICIT, IT'S NOT THE ENTIRE NEIGHBORHOOD.

BUT OUT OF 500 MEMBERS SURVEYED, 153 RESPONDED, 84% FELT THAT TRAFFIC CONGESTION AND SPEEDING WAS AN ISSUE, AND 73% SUPPORTED A SIDEWALK ON SAN JUAN DRIVE.

IN SEPTEMBER OF 2021, THE PVA DECIDED TO GO DOOR TO DOOR AND STICK A SURVEY REQUEST IN EVERYONE'S MAILBOX ON THE 300 BLOCK, WHICH IS IN BETWEEN SOLANO ROAD AND MIRANDA, WHICH IS THE MOST HEAVILY TRAFFICKED EXCUSE ME AREA.

80% OF THE PEOPLE DID RESPOND, AND 65% FELT THAT PARKING ON THE STREET WAS A PROBLEM AND 65% SUPPORTED THE SIDEWALK ON SAN JUAN DRIVE, BACKING UP WITH AL HOLLAND'S SURVEY DID THE EXACT SAME NUMBERS, ALMOST THE EXACT SAME NUMBERS.

IT IS A SAFETY ISSUE. I CAN READ OFF MANY DIFFERENT SCENARIOS THAT WERE EXTREMELY DANGEROUS THAT I WITNESSED.

YOU ALMOST HAVE TO BE AN EXPERT TELEPATHIC MIND READER TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT IT'S CLEAR FOR YOU TO PASS AROUND A PARKED VEHICLE.

ON ONE OCCASION, I WITNESSED 28 CARS PARKED IN UNISON, 500FT DOWN SAN JUAN DRIVE THAT YOU HAD TO TRY TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAD A CLEAR PATH TO GO AROUND. THESE 28 CARS THAT EXISTED FOR AN ENTIRE DAY.

NO FLAG PERSON. THERE IS A HOME ACROSS THE STREET FROM CHRIST CHURCH ON THE CORNER OF SOLANO ROAD AND SAN JUAN DRIVE.

2 OR 3 WEEK LANDSCAPING PROJECT OCCURRED. MULTIPLE TRUCKS ON THIS CURVE WERE PARKED ALL DAY LONG, AND WHEN YOU DROVE AROUND IT, YOU WERE ENCOUNTERING PEOPLE LEAVING THE CHURCH AND PEOPLE DRIVING SOUTH ON THE BOULEVARD.

EXTREMELY SCARY AND DANGEROUS, MUCH LESS IF YOU THROW A PEDESTRIAN IN THE MIX OF IT.

THE THE NO PARKING ORDINANCE WILL ONLY ADDRESS PART OF THE SAFETY ISSUE.

HOWEVER, A SIDEWALK HOPEFULLY WILL BE ON THE AGENDA SOMEDAY VERY SOON THAT WILL ADDRESS THE SAFETY ISSUE THAT PEDESTRIANS HAVE TODAY.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

GOOD AFTERNOON. GOOD AFTERNOON, MADAM CHAIR. VICE CHAIR, COMMISSIONERS.

THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO ADDRESS YOU TODAY. A LOT WAS SAID, AND ONE OF THE MOST CONCERNING PORTIONS OF THIS WHOLE DEBATE HAS BEEN FACT FOR YOU. WOULD YOU STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, PLEASE? OH I APOLOGIZE. CLAUDIA THOMAS, 342 SAN JUAN DRIVE.

AS I STATED, ONE OF THE MOST CONCERNING PARTS OF THIS ENTIRE DEBATE HAS BEEN FACT VERSUS FICTION.

AND I'VE LIVED AT THIS ADDRESS FOR 16 YEARS. IT'S CONCERNING THAT MISREPRESENTATIONS HAVE BEEN MADE ABOUT THE POSITION OF THE MAJORITY OF THE NEIGHBORS. THERE ARE ABOUT 130 HOMES ON SAN JUAN DRIVE.

THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE RESIDENTS LIVING IN A POINT WHICH IS A TOWNHOUSE DEVELOPMENT.

AND ONE OF THE PRIMARY CONCERNS, OF COURSE, IS THAT MANY OF THE HOUSES WERE CONSTRUCTED WITH JUST ONE POINT OF INGRESS AND EGRESS,

[04:45:04]

WHICH DOES COMPLICATE MATTERS AS IT PERTAINS TO HAVING SERVICE PROVIDERS AT HOMES AND INSTANCES IN WHICH THERE ARE MULTIPLE CARS PARKED AND THE OWNER CANNOT QUICKLY AND AS NEEDED, LEAVE AND DEPART.

I WOULD ALSO REMIND THE BOARD THAT I JUST HEARD FROM MR. HOLLAND REPRESENT THAT THE NO PARKING SIGNS ON THE FAIRWAY WERE PUT THERE AT THE SHERIFF'S REQUEST.

AT LEAST THAT'S WHAT I UNDERSTOOD THAT HE JUST STATED.

AND I QUICKLY TEXTED SHERIFF HARDWICK TO ASCERTAIN BECAUSE THAT'S THE FIRST TIME EVER HEARING IF THAT WAS ACCURATE.

AND HIS RESPONSE WAS, NO, MA'AM. CERTAINLY VERY CONCERNING THAT REPRESENTATIONS WOULD BE MADE THAT ARE WHOLLY INACCURATE AS IT PERTAINS TO ANY SURVEYS THAT HAVE BEEN PERFORMED. THE MOST RECENT SURVEY WAS DONE IN DECEMBER, AND THERE WAS A FOLLOW UP ONE, AND MY CONCERNS ARE AS FOLLOWS.

IT'S PREDOMINANTLY THAT IT'S NOT A SCIENTIFIC METHOD, THAT THE METHOD IS SKEWED.

THE QUESTIONNAIRE WAS DESIGNED IN A WAY TO BE BIASED AS THOUGH THE PHRASEOLOGY.

I'M NOT SURE WHERE THE SAMPLING OF EMAILS CAME FROM, BECAUSE MOST OF MY NEIGHBORS STATED THAT THEY NEVER RECEIVED ANY KIND OF EMAIL WITH A QUESTIONNAIRE. YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE PROVIDED THE MSD OR I'M NOT EVEN SURE WHAT SOURCE YOUR EMAIL.

I'M ALSO CONCERNED ABOUT THE MANNER IN WHICH THE INFORMATION WAS WAS COLLECTED.

I NEVER SAW IT. THERE'S NOTHING WORSE THAN A GOTCHA MOMENT.

TODAY WAS THE FIRST TIME THAT I'VE EVER HEARD ANY RESULTS COMMUNICATED.

WE'D HAVE A CHANCE TO REVIEW ANY COMMENTS OR ANYTHING OF THAT SORT.

SO THAT'S CERTAINLY TROUBLING. AS FAR AS PRIOR SURVEYS THAT WERE TAKEN, I'M AWARE OF AN INITIATIVE TO ASCERTAIN WHETHER OR NOT RESIDENTS WERE COMFORTABLE WITH SAFETY IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD. AND CERTAINLY MOST RESIDENTS ARE GOING TO RESPOND THAT THEY WOULD LIKE A SAFE NEIGHBORHOOD, BUT THEY DIDN'T KNOW IS THAT THERE WAS AN INITIATIVE TO PURSUE THIS NO PARKING INITIATIVE.

I THANK YOU, AND I APPRECIATE YOUR YOU KNOW, YOUR OPPORTUNITY TO LOOK AT ALL THE FACTS SELECTIVELY IN THIS PROCESS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH. THANK YOU MA'AM. GOOD AFTERNOON.

SO BEAR WITH ME. SO I'M GOING TO HAVE THIS RUN WHILE I TALK.

SO YOU MOST OF YOU RECEIVED THIS LAST NIGHT, AND I APOLOGIZE FOR BEING THERE LATE.

OKAY. SO MY NAME IS CLAIRE SIBLEY. I LIVE ACROSS THE STREET FROM WES AND CATTY CORNER FROM CLAUDIA AT 339 SAN JUAN DRIVE.

I MOVED IN A YEAR AND A HALF AGO, AND WHEN I MOVED IN, I BARGAINED FOR THE FACT THAT THE STREET WAS A CUT THROUGH STREET.

BUT I ALSO BARGAINED FOR IT TO BE A RESIDENTIAL STREET.

AND NOT BE TREATED LIKE A THRUWAY STREET. I WAS, AND STILL AM GOOD WITH THE FACT THAT IT IS A CUT THROUGH STREET.

WE DO EXPERIENCE PEOPLE CUTTING THROUGH TO GO USE THE USE THE CLUB.

I'M EXPECTING THAT THAT WILL INCREASE WITH THE CONSTRUCTION, BUT IT'S THERE AND I.

IT'S FINE. I'M AN AVID WALKER AND RUNNER. I RUN ALONG ALL OF SAN JUAN FROM ONE END TO THE NEXT.

I RUN ON THE MASTER. I RUN ON THE BOULEVARD. THE COMPARISONS TO OUR STREET AND TO PONTE VEDRA BOULEVARD ARE JUST SO DIFFERENT. LOOK AT THIS. IT'S TAKING MY MY LANDSCAPE CREW TWO MINUTES TO GET OUT.

AND THAT'S WITH TWO PEOPLE. I KNOW THAT CHRISTA JOSEPH SAID IT WAS BECAUSE OF THE CAR.

THE CAR THAT WAS PARKED THERE HAD NO BEARING ON IT.

WE MADE SURE OF THAT BEFORE ASKING THEM TO MOVE IT.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT THE FACT IS THAT THE GUY DOESN'T WANT TO GO ON MY YARD OR WES'S YARD.

SO SO I AM A BIG WALKER AND RUNNER, AND I VIGOROUSLY MAINTAIN THAT THE PARKED CARS DO HELP SLOW THE CARS DOWN WHEN THERE ARE NO CARS PARKED.

THAT STREET IS A FREEWAY AND I SEE IT ALL THE TIME.

THE PEDESTRIANS THAT CHOOSE TO WALK ON THE STREET.

MANY OF THEM ARE VERY DISTRACTED. THEY'VE GOT THEIR TWO HEADPHONES IN.

THERE'S THIS ONE WOMAN WHO WALKS WITH HER TWO DOGS IN A STROLLER.

HER DOGS ARE BARKING. SHE'S GOT DOUBLE HEADSETS IN AND SHE DOESN'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.

SO YES, SHE MAY FEEL A LITTLE UNSAFE, BUT THAT'S BY HER OWN DOING, IN MY OPINION.

IF NO PARKING IS PUT IN PLACE, I FEEL IT WILL RESULT IN PITTING NEIGHBOR VERSUS NEIGHBOR.

I SAY THIS BASED ON EMAILS THAT I SAW THAT WERE WRITTEN TO THE BOARD.

[04:50:02]

SPECIFICALLY CALLING OUT MY PROPERTY. MY PROPERTY IS BIG.

IT WAS RECENTLY BUILT. THERE WERE A LOT OF CONSTRUCTION CREWS THERE.

THERE ARE STILL A LOT OF CREWS THAT ARE THERE.

I HAVE A HAVE A LANDSCAPE CREW. I HAVE A POOL, PEOPLE.

I'VE GOT LOTS OF PEOPLE. I'M VERY LUCKY. I HAVE LOTS OF PEOPLE, BUT THEY DO COME TO MY PROPERTY AND THEY DO NOT PARK IN MY DRIVEWAY.

I HAVE STARTED TO ASK THEM TO NOT PARK AT THE END OF WES'S DRIVEWAY BECAUSE I REALIZED, WOW, THAT'S PROBABLY BOTHERING HIM. SO I SPECIFICALLY ASKED THEM NOW TO MOVE TO PARK ON THE OTHER SIDE WHERE THERE ARE NO PEOPLE ACROSS MY PROPERTY.

I ALSO WANTED TO SAY THAT BY MAKING IT A NO PARKING, IT WILL BE A FREEWAY.

AND I THINK RIGHT NOW IT IS ACTUALLY SAFER WITH HAVING PARKED CARS.

VEHEMENTLY AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT. THANK YOU.

ANYONE ELSE FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? FOR AGENDA ITEM NUMBER FOUR. SEEING NONE, I WILL CLOSE PUBLIC COMMENT.

ALL RIGHT. ANY FOLLOW UP? YES, MADAM CHAIR. I JUST WANT TO WANT TO RESPOND TO MISS THOMAS'S COMMENT ABOUT SAID THAT SHERIFF HARDWICK WASN'T AWARE OF THE REQUEST FOR THE NO PARKING.

I DIDN'T ASK SHERIFF HARDWICK. I ASKED DEPUTY JOHN TANNER.

HE IS A REGULAR DEPUTY ASSIGNED, AND HE ASKED ME TO HAVE THE NO PARKING BECAUSE UP THERE BY THE GOLF COURSE THERE WAS, HE SAID THERE WAS A LOT OF CONGESTION THERE.

SO THE RESIDENTS WANTED IT SAID A LOT OF KIDS GET OVER PARK OVER THERE AND THEY LITTER WITH BEER CANS AND ALL LIKE THAT.

HE SAID IT NEEDED TO HAVE NO PARKING THERE, SO I DID THAT AT THE SHERIFF DEPUTIES REQUEST.

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. DO WE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD? I HAVE A QUESTION. YES. I WAS JUST CURIOUS. HOW DO THE PEOPLE ON PONTE VEDRA BOULEVARD, HOW DO THEY MANAGE THEIR LANDSCAPING? TRUCKS, LIKE WE JUST SAW IN THE VIDEO. HOW HOW WHAT ARE THEY DOING ON PONTE VEDRA BOULEVARD? WELL. SOME OF THOSE THEY HAVE, SOME OF THEM HAVE HAVE TWO THEY HAVE A CURVED SOME OF THEM HAVE, HAVE CURVED DRIVEWAY. AND OTHERS, YOU KNOW, THEY GET IN THE DRIVEWAY OR. IT CAN, IT CAN BE A PROBLEM WITH, WITH SOME OF SOME OF THOSE BIG TRUCKS.

THERE'S A LOT OF CONSTRUCTION ON PONTE VEDRA BOULEVARD, A LOT A LOT OF BIG, A LOT OF BIG.

AND THAT ORDINANCE REALLY DOESN'T AFFECT THEM BECAUSE THEY'RE DELIVERING A LOT OF EQUIPMENT.

AND, YOU KNOW, THE DEPUTIES, THE DEPUTIES, THE DEPUTY WE HAVE THEY DO ASK THEM TO HAVE SOMEBODY KIND OF MOTIONING FOR THE TRAFFIC TO COME AROUND.

SO IT'S IT'S BEEN AN ISSUE. WE HAVE A LOT, OF LOT OF RESIDENTS ASK US ABOUT ABOUT THE NO PARKING.

AND UPON EVERY BOULEVARD, IT SEEMS. IT SEEMS IT SEEMS TO BE WORKING.

I MEAN, SOME SURE, SOME DO PULL, PULL ALONG THE SIDE OF THE STREET.

THEY'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO PARK ON THE ON THE SIDEWALKS.

AND THE DEPUTIES DO GET THEM TO MOVE ALONG. SO, I MEAN, WE WE POLICE IT THE BEST WE CAN TO TRY TO TRY TO NOT IMPEDE THE FLOW OF TRAFFIC. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? THE ONLY COMMENT I HAVE IS IN THE VIDEO. IF THE RED CAR HADN'T BEEN PARKED ON THE STREET, HE COULD HAVE JUST PULLED OUT.

NO. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE WITH NO CHANGES.

MOTION TO ENACT ORDINANCE 2025, DASH NUMBER ONE, APPROVING AN AMENDMENT TO SECTION.

I THINK THAT'S SUPPOSED TO BE 11 DASH DOT D DOT ONE.

TWO OF THE PONTE VEDRA ZONING DISTRICT REGULATIONS RELATING TO OFF STREET PARKING REQUIREMENTS AND LIMITATIONS.

NO. SECOND. SECOND. WE HAVE A MOTION A SECOND, AND SHOULD WE JUST VOTE? OKAY. THAT PASSES 3 TO 2. THANK YOU.

MOVE ON. WE ARE NOT DOING NUMBER FIVE, SO WE'RE GOING TO SIX.

[6. Public Hearing * COMPAMD 2024-03 Schneider Family Campground (Transmittal). Request for a Large-Scale Comprehensive Plan Amendment to change the Future Land Use Map designation from Rural/Silviculture (R/S) to Rural Commercial (RC) for approximately 120 acres of land, specifically located at 8000 US Hwy 1 South. The Planning and Zoning Agency (PZA) heard this request at their regularly scheduled public hearing on November 21, 2024, and recommended approval with a vote of 6-1. One of the Agency members read into the record a letter from the South Anastasia Communities Association (SACA) in which it stated concerns about the potential intensive uses of the site and asked that the Agency recommend denial or offer a less intense alternative. The Agency members deliberated the potential for additional intensive uses of the site should the amendment be approved, emphasizing the necessity to restrict the allowable uses and expressing concerns regarding the implications of well and septic system additions. While some members acknowledged the beneficial aspects of utilizing the site in this manner, others raised questions about the current number of RV campgrounds in the vicinity and the appropriateness of the location for such use. The Agency further considered the advantages of introducing a text amendment to confine the use to RV Campgrounds and ancillary services. The applicant committed to providing use limitations within the Rezoning application that runs concurrent to the comprehensive plan amendment adoption. Public discussion included topics such as the existing wetlands on the property, the presence of small, private campgrounds in the area, competition with nearby Airbnb rentals, and the importance of retaining equestrian activities on-site.]

GOOD AFTERNOON, MADAM CHAIR. COMMISSIONERS FOR THE RECORD, JAMES WHITEHOUSE, SAINT JOHN'S LAW GROUP, 104 SEAGROVE MAIN STREET HERE IN SAINT JOHNS COUNTY, FLORIDA. I AM HERE ON BEHALF OF THE SNYDER FAMILY FOR COMP PLAN AMENDMENT 2020 403.

[04:55:05]

THIS IS A REQUEST TO UPDATE THE LAND USE TO ALLOW FOR AN RV CAMPGROUND, IN ADDITION TO UPDATING THE OTHER EXISTING USES ON THIS SITE.

AS MANY OF YOU KNOW, THIS SITE IS THE THE LARGE CLEARED SITE ON THE EAST SIDE OF US, ONE IN BETWEEN THE INTERSECTION WHERE 206 AND US ONE COME TOGETHER AND 95 AND US ONE COME TOGETHER.

IT'S A LARGELY WOODED AREA ON BOTH SIDES, AS YOU KNOW.

THE STATE PARK AND THE STATE FOREST KIND OF WRAP AROUND THIS PARTICULAR SITE ITSELF.

IT'S IT'S LOCATED. WE FEEL THAT THIS IS A PERFECT SITE FOR THE REQUESTED USE.

IT'S LOCATED AMONGST AND IN DIRECT PROXIMITY TO MANY OF OUR COUNTY'S NATURAL RESOURCES AND ATTRACTIONS BEACH ACCESS, STATE FOREST, STATE PARKS, WATERWAYS. HIKING TRAILS, HISTORICAL SITES, ATTRACTIONS WHICH HELPED THIS REQUEST TO SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS THE GOALS, POLICIES AND OBJECTIVES OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.

OOPS. THIS TYPE OF USE IS PROMOTED BY OUR COUNTY AND BY OUR CHAMBER OF COMMERCE SPECIFICALLY.

IT'S ALSO, AS I SAID, LOCATED AMONGST IN DIRECT PROXIMITY TO MANY OF OUR COUNTY'S NATURAL RESOURCES.

CRESCENT BEACH IS JUST ACROSS THE BRIDGE AT 206.

IT'S COMPLETELY SURROUNDED ON ALL SIDES BY FABER DIKE STATE PARK AND THE MATANZAS STATE FOREST.